Looks Like AVI is Back in the Game!

[pierregloom]

Well gentlemen,
My thoughts about the AVI M422a I received:
I'm disappointed!
First I have to clarify that I ordered a G1 from AVI two years ago (first gen.) and I absolutely love that jacket. Sure it has one or two inaccuracies but it looks super nice, fits super nice and is tough like hell.
So I just want to tell you guys that I don't have a aversion against AVI and because of my good experiences with their G1 I thought I cannot go wrong with the M422a.
My disappointment results in following things;
- the cut is OK but maybe a little short for a M422a.
- the shoulder seam (from shoulder to neck) is sewn the wrong way round.
- there should be two seams on the top of each pockets (not the flaps) but there's only one.
- everywhere when you look closer at seams or the points where leather pieces are joined you can see that everything was frequently glued up before it was sewn together.
- the left pocket is exactly the same width like the right one, even they tell the opposite in their description like it should be.
- the throat tab is too long.
- but the most disappointment results in the leather they use. It is THIN and so supple that it can't even hold shape. The Bi-swings folds open constantly (jacket isn't too trim) because of the flimsy leather in addition with a construction fault (?) what makes the jacket almost unwearable.
First thing I noticed as I received the package was "whoa that thing is light".
The color is OK even it's very dull and a nuance too dark.
- the seams are done sloppily here and there.

The whole jacket appears cheap and in comparison to the G1 there are worlds between these two jackets.
Changing the manufacturer was not AVI's best choice in my opinion.
Sorry for not having better news, maybe it's just my pretty own experience and someone else may see it different but that was not what I wanted.

Cheers
Enigma

Thanks for your review... I'm supposed to receive mine today, I hope that like you said it will be just your own experience. It worries me to be able to find if there are problems with my jacket. Mine is not custom sized so I think that would not be a problem, but as it was my first purchase of an "original cut" of a vintage leather jacket, I'm kind of disapointed even before I opened the package...

 

[Micawber]

The glue or double sided tape is commonly used in the manufacture of mass produced leather wear to position pieces prior to sewing. It's use can be seen in the "B3" construction video that Mike posted a couple of days ago.

 

[Brettafett]

Heres an idea gents...
Why not send Morten an email, kindly listing the issues.
From personal experience, Im sure he will aim to make it 'right' with you.
Also, this will help him improve his jacket.

As I understand these are custom-made, so they should be able to check those issues and update (I certainly hope so).

I know from many back&forth emails, that he is trying to make decent repros, has invested quite a bit on his originals and is developing quite a passion for these jackets.
I guess there is only so much one can do, having jackets made out of Pakistan.

I think its also important to remember that these jackets, both AVI and 5* are sub-$300 repros, made by people who usually make leather fashion jackets.
If you want the detailing and quality comparable to an original, you simply have to fork out and wait for a GW, BK, ELC or Sheeley etc
Or, as many will recommend, find an original and restore it.

Im still of the opinion that its important to support and encourage these guys where one can.
Take AVI and 5* out of the game and what are you left with in the entry-level range?
Secondhand Ebay buys, Cockpit, US Wings...
Theres always room to improve. I have had almost every incarnation of AVI's 'Bronco', some better, some not so much, and yes, some details missing etc... But really, these are very decent wearable repro A-2s compared to the other budget/ mid range I've owned...

 

[pierregloom]

I just received and opened my M422-A package, I will write a longer post later, but I can tell you that, as a noob in flight jacket world, (even if I have learnt a lot thanks to the forum) I am happy with this jacket !!!
Yes the leather is thin, but I don't have the same "bat wing" problem with the bi-swing, it's a size 40.
The color is nice, I have to go outside to make photos, the mouton collar feels great, the only detail I've noticed is that the pockets are of the same size... But it's my first one, and as Brett said just before, "these jackets, both AVI and 5* are sub-$300 repros".
Now I go back to look at it more and more !!!

 

[pierregloom]

Here are my very first pictures of my M422-A, the color is not exactly the same in real (taken with an iphone SE 2020, in my kitchen with a bit of natural and electical light), but it helped me realizing if the size was good, and I think it is.
May be people that have a better knowledge of what is right or what is wrong could say it better than me when they'll try on their own jacket, but as I said before, it is my first AVI jacket and historical flight jacket cut, and the look of it is amazing.
As some of you have said in other threads, the collar is really great (according to me) very very soft.

 

[pierregloom]

And a few details with the same light :

 

[Brettafett]

I can honestly say that looks fantastic! The fit looks perfect for an M-422A, thats how they were worn.
I can see some of the missing details @Enigma1938 mentioned, and I think those can largely be improved upon.
Mouton collar looks great (better than my ELCs (!?!), knits look good, colour is fine really, originals can be seen in all shades...
All in all... Very nice!
Currently on Ebay
G&F M-422A

Flight Suits' renovated original M-422A

 

[pierregloom]

I can honestly say that looks fantastic! The fit looks perfect for an M-422A, thats how they were worn.
I can see some of the missing details @Enigma1938 mentioned, and I think those can largely be improved upon.
Mouton collar looks great (better than my ELCs (!?!), knits look good, colour is fine really, originals can be seen in all shades...
All in all... Very nice!
Currently on Ebay
G&F M-422A
View attachment 71546
Flight Suits' renovated original M-422A
View attachment 71547

I imagine that everyone has his own little detail that matters more than another, and the good size and collar are the first things I wanted to check. And I suppose that when it was a time of war production, the important was to have the right number of jackets, and details should have varied from one to another, not taking into account the differences between the different makers.
You said (@Brettafett ) that your ELC collar does not look better and, according to pictures I've seen, I prefer when it's more "bushy" if the word can be used for a jacket collar, like it was in AVI's picture, and I'm very happy to see and feelhow it is for real !

 

[Greg Gale]

That looks great, Pierre! For reference, what is your height and weight?

 

[Brettafett]

Good question Greg, also chest size?

Some details are specific and important to differentiate makers, and in this case there are a couple of things AVI can do better.
Then again, its up to them.
They have purposefully not created a copy of the G&F label, so does this give them artistic license? Maybe...

 

[YoungMedic]

View attachment 71536

Looks awesome! I'd wear it all day long. Enjoy!

 

[mulceber]

Looks like you got a great jacket, Pierre! I’d like to see a heavier, lighter brown hide, but for an entry—level jacket, that’s quite good. And as Brett said, it’s important to support the entry-level market. Here’s hoping Brett is similarly satisfied when his arrives.

 

[pierregloom]

That looks great, Pierre! For reference, what is your height and weight?

Thanks !

Here are my measurements :
- Size : 1.76m
- Weight : 65kg

- Chest : 92cm (around)
- Shoulder : 43cm
- Sleeve : 60cm
- Waist : 79cm

@Brettafett : I was saying myself the same thing when I saw the label 'Jacket intermediate BuAero - us Navy etc.' replacing 'Gordon & Ferguson' by 'Avi Leather Denmark', and the new label beside the interior pocket saying "made in Pakistan" (with maintenance recommandation etc.), it could be interpreted like "It's our interpretation of a vintage model".
Anyway, I also think that we can not have every advantages of an original or an high quality repro for that kind of price.

 

[ausreenactor]

And a few details with the same light :
View attachment 71539View attachment 71540View attachment 71541View attachment 71542View attachment 71543View attachment 71544View attachment 71545

That looks great. Thought the tag was staying for a while!

Enjoy it.

 

[pierregloom]

I've read once again AVI's description for the M422-A and actually it's not mentionned that the left pocket is larger than the right one, but "Some distinguishing characteristics of the G&F, is its wider pencil slot pocket and its salmon red lining."
So if I'm not mistaken, they don't say the left pocket is wider than the right one, but the pencil pocket is wider than the one on other manufacturers, no?
They play with words maybe because it must be more expensive to have 2 different pockets (even if an original M422-A one would have the pencil slot pocket AND the left pocket different in size, compared to other manufacturer and compared to the right pocket too).

I agree with all of you saying that some of these small details could be improved (if AVI wants to), nevertheless I'm really happy with my jacket, it's a great entry model for the price, even more for someone like me who is new to this hobby.

 

[mulceber]

I've read once again AVI's description for the M422-A and actually it's not mentionned that the left pocket is larger than the right one, but "Some distinguishing characteristics of the G&F, is its wider pencil slot pocket and its salmon red lining."
So if I'm not mistaken, they don't say the left pocket is wider than the right one, but the pencil pocket is wider than the one on other manufacturers, no?

Yeah, but the pocket with the pencil slot is the left pocket, and that's a well-known feature of the contract they're reproducing, so, if that's their logic, it really doesn't hold up. If I had to guess, I'd say a breakdown in communication between them and the factory is to blame: different sized pockets that are symmetrically placed is a pretty odd feature, so I wouldn't be surprised if people at the factory either didn't notice it, or assumed it was a mistake in the patterns.

Regardless, it's a nice entry-level model, as you said.

 

[Brettafett]

Just arrived.
Initial impressions. I love it. Super comfy and fits great.
Yes, yes... Not a GW, not a Sheeley, not a BK or ELC... some details are amiss... but hell, its a swanky little jacket.
Leather might feel slightly on the thinner side, but its not bad, its close to my ELC Monarch in thickness, feels about same as my previous ELC M-422A and original FO, its just a bit more supple.
Colour is fine, wouldn't change it, knits are fine and mouton is way nicer than on my ELC jacket (sorry guys), more like my BR (Gary should find this supplier)...
Im working, so will do a more detailed look-see later, but for now...

 

[pierregloom]

Great ! Happy to see that you're satisfied of this jacket too ! It look great on you .

I didn't have your experience of other brands to compare my feelings about this M422-A, so it's interesting to read that you think it's not a bad jacket !
Knits and mouton are the details I love the most on it .

Concerning mine, I've contacted Morten and ordered one size 38 to try, and I will return the one that doesn't fits the best...
I know everyone here and there told me the fit was good, but, as I've had a bad experience with a previous non-repro jacket, which was really to big for me, I prefer to try between 40 and 38, even if I have to pay a bit more to return it...
I've been living with doubts concerning that previous jacket for two years and I really do not want to make the same mistake again.
It may be a bit ridiculous, but I will feel better trying than asking myself every day I wear it : shouldn't it be better one size down?

So for the moment my M422-A is waiting, so I don't ruin it before I try on the other size.

 

[Brettafett]

Its a good idea actually, Ive done that twice with AVI in the past, ordering two sizes to compare.
Yes, you pay return postage, but you're assured on best fit.

 

[Brettafett]

I concur with some of Enigmas thoughts on the jacket.
Namely the left pocket should be wider for a G&F, the leather could be slightly thicker, missing the stitching below the fur collar and the hang tag should be sewn at the neck join.

The back panel is sometimes sewn over the front panels and sometimes its the other way round. You can find originals of both variations. I think AVI followed their original.

I had emailed AVI after reading the above (my jacket was already on the way) and asked them to check these details. Im not sure if it was this or if Enigma also contacted them, but I received a brief reply to say that these issues would be updated on future jackets.
So, if you order a 38 Pierre, it should be the 'updated' version. I'd check with Morten before you order.