Modern German Flieger Jacke

[Chandler]

Thought I'd start a new thread for those of us interested in the more modern German flight jackets.

Here's mine from 1982. A Hauptmann ranked with the reversible emergency orange liner.

It's a very pebbly hide that reminds me of goatskin, but I have no idea what it is.

Anyone else in possession of one of these? Also, can anyone I.D. the breast patch?

@B-Man2
@Cyril

 

[Cyril]

Thought I'd start a new thread for those of us interested in the more modern German flight jackets.

Here's mine from 1982. A Hauptmann ranked with the reversible emergency orange liner.

It's a very pebbly hide that reminds me of goatskin, but I have no idea what it is.

Anyone else in possession of one of these? Also, can anyone I.D. the breast patch?

@B-Man2
@Cyril

The hide is goat.
The breastpatch belongs to Hubschraubergeschwader 64 (Helicopter Squadron 64) based in Laupheim near Ulm. It is the only helicopter-squadron attached to the Luftwaffe (Airforce), all others belong to Heer (Army). They fly Sikorsky CH-53, Bell UH-1D, NH90 and Airbus H145M.

 

[Cyril]

here you can find an overview on german Luftwaffe Squadron-ensignia/patches.

Liste der Wappen der Luftwaffe der Bundeswehr – Wikipedia

de.wikipedia.org

 

[Pilot]

Thought I'd start a new thread for those of us interested in the more modern German flight jackets.

Here's mine from 1982. A Hauptmann ranked with the reversible emergency orange liner.

It's a very pebbly hide that reminds me of goatskin, but I have no idea what it is.

Anyone else in possession of one of these? Also, can anyone I.D. the breast patch?

@B-Man2
@Cyril

Textbook jacket.
Thanks for sharing.

 

[Chandler]

here you can find an overview on german Luftwaffe Squadron-ensignia/patches.

Liste der Wappen der Luftwaffe der Bundeswehr – Wikipedia

de.wikipedia.org

Hubschraubertransportgeschwader 64 – Wikipedia

de.m.wikipedia.org

Looks like this is the group my jacket came from as I can pinpoint that I bought mine before 2010 (when the current Sqd was formed).

Thanks for the great link resources.

 

[Cyril]

Hubschraubertransportgeschwader 64 – Wikipedia

de.m.wikipedia.org

Looks like this is the group my jacket came from as I can pinpoint that I bought mine before 2010 (when the current Sqd was formed).

Thanks for the great link resources.

Happy to be able to help when i can

 

[Cyril]

Hubschraubertransportgeschwader 64 – Wikipedia

de.m.wikipedia.org

Looks like this is the group my jacket came from as I can pinpoint that I bought mine before 2010 (when the current Sqd was formed).

Thanks for the great link resources.

This squadron was formed in 2010 out of Squadron 25 that existed since the 70s. If you bought it before 2010 it might probably have stiches from helicopter squadron 25 underneath. But the pilot might have also served in any other squadron before. Being a "Hauptmann" (captain) makes him (or her?) have served for a while already.

Medium Transport Helicopter Regiment 25 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Cyril]

found an interesting early one:

Vintage 1960's German Military Leather Flight Jacket RARE - Etsy.de

Vintage 1960s German Military Leather Flight Jacket RARE Fliegerlederjacke Split-S Aviation EL Cajon California Large 42 USA Contract . Excellent Condition *measures snug large 22 armpit to armpit, 27 Collar to Hem

www.etsy.com

The jacket, its (slightly corroding) zipper etc. looks genuine and the fact that german pilots have been trained for decades in the US makes an early US fabrication conclusive. In the sixties patches including the small german flags on the shoulders were often absent. The bell-shaped scovill zipper pull looks interesting too. The only thing is the "Made in USA" tag that to me looks more recent, but what do i know...


below a early picture of a german pilot after ww2 from 1958, trained in the uk (see british helmet)

 

[Pilot]

Thanks for all photos.
Never saw an issued one with handwarmers.
Maybe some evidences with photos?

 

[Cyril]

Thanks for all photos.
Never saw an issued one with handwarmers.
Maybe some evidences with photos?

pictures below are maybe no "evidence" but small alterations may have occured trough time. and again i am no real expert on these jackets.
the black and white picture below for example shows a breast pocket with an horizontal zipper instead of the vertikal often seen. Unfortunately one does not find a lot of pictures of pilots wearing them in the 60s.

 

[Cyril]

fun fact: the swiss airforce used almost the same jackets with a little alteration to put a rank patch on the chest (similar to french leather flight jackets)

 

[Chandler]

This squadron was formed in 2010 out of Squadron 25 that existed since the 70s. If you bought it before 2010 it might probably have stiches from helicopter squadron 25 underneath. But the pilot might have also served in any other squadron before. Being a "Hauptmann" (captain) makes him (or her?) have served for a while already.

Medium Transport Helicopter Regiment 25 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

HTG 64, 1966 to 1994. Same patch.

Hubschraubertransportgeschwader 64 – Wikipedia

de.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Pilot]

pictures below are maybe no "evidence" but small alterations may have occured trough time. and again i am no real expert on these jackets.
the black and white picture below for example shows a breast pocket with an horizontal zipper instead of the vertikal often seen. Unfortunately one does not find a lot of pictures of pilots wearing them in the 60s.




View attachment 85928View attachment 85929

very early Bundesluftwaffe flight jacket ( 1955/56 version) no handwarmers

 

[Pilot]

Swiss and German Air Forces… not the same IMHO… I Understand we discuss German… not Swiss…
No clue at all and zero interest in Swiss items ( with all due respect since their watches/chronos/chocolate are great stuff )

 

[Wholenineyards]

This is the holy grail of Bundeswehr flight jackets. First generation issue, the angular chest pocket. Lieutenant Colonel (Oberstleutnant) rank. 1958ish.

 

[Wholenineyards]

found an interesting early one:

Vintage 1960's German Military Leather Flight Jacket RARE - Etsy.de

Vintage 1960s German Military Leather Flight Jacket RARE Fliegerlederjacke Split-S Aviation EL Cajon California Large 42 USA Contract . Excellent Condition *measures snug large 22 armpit to armpit, 27 Collar to Hem

www.etsy.com

View attachment 85923



The jacket, its (slightly corroding) zipper etc. looks genuine and the fact that german pilots have been trained for decades in the US makes an early US fabrication conclusive. In the sixties patches including the small german flags on the shoulders were often absent. The bell-shaped scovill zipper pull looks interesting too. The only thing is the "Made in USA" tag that to me looks more recent, but what do i know...


below a early picture of a german pilot after ww2 from 1958, trained in the uk (see british helmet)

View attachment 85922

I am afraid no Bundeswehr flight jacket has been issued with hand warmer pockets, those are commercial reproductions. The grey German flight jackets enjoyed the same popularity there as the G-1 and A-2 jackets in the US. We all wanted one growing up in the 80s.

 

[Pilot]

View attachment 85961
This is the holy grail of Bundeswehr flight jackets. First generation issue, the angular chest pocket. Lieutenant Colonel (Oberstleutnant) rank. 1958ish.View attachment 85960View attachment 85962

Thanks for sharing,
these early jackets are the rarest and most wanted of all BW jackets…
Congrats

 

[Cyril]

I am afraid no Bundeswehr flight jacket has been issued with hand warmer pockets, those are commercial reproductions. The grey German flight jackets enjoyed the same popularity there as the G-1 and A-2 jackets in the US. We all wanted one growing up in the 80s.

Thank you for bringing a little light in here. Awsome jacket you have there!

 

[Bremspropeller]

@Wholenineyards thats an awesome jacket!

Do you know if the colour has been changed some time during those early issues?
I do know photos with the jacket being almost as dark bluish-grey as the later Marineflieger version of this jacket, not the brighter grey of the later Luftwaffe and Heeresflieger issued jackets. I think this is also evident in the group-photo with most of the pilots having the dark one and the couple few on the left do have the (later?) brighter issue.

 

[Bremspropeller]

I know linking to vendors isn't too popular around here, but sometimes I find myself browsing through the forums, aghast at the jackets somebody's got and kind of missing out on the information where to get the stuff, so I'll just post a link for those who are thinking about getting an original of these jackets and wanting an original.

The comment about outside (and internal) side-pockets being a non-original isn't fully accurate. Most cheap, cheapish or medium-quality/ fidelity repros will have them. But the original manufacturer (Beckumer Lederwerke) also offered the option for their civvie versions without the german flag on the shoulder* and with the option of external hand-warmer pockets and also optional inside pockets. How do I know? I have two of those myself - one bought through an external distributor (my Marineflieger petrol-coloured) and one through the manufacturer itself, who nowadays unfortunately seems to just offer biking-equipment on their website.

You can get a civvie without these pockets (and stitch the flag on if you want to) or a spec jacket.

Back to the site I mentioned earlier. I'm in no way, shape or form affiliated to this site and beware, there seems to only be a german site (no english version), so shop at your own risk. Anyway, I think getting a new original is better than getting a questionable "original" or a cheap repro off the bay.

You could get a "spec jacket" new or used (used seems to be out of stock ATM) at a Bundeswehr-Shop here:

Original Bundeswehr Fliegerjacke Grau | BW-Shop

Original Bundeswehr Fliegerjacke grau online bestellen - versicherter Versand weltweit mit DHL✔ 30 Tage Rückgaberecht✔ Kundenservice unter 03877 561171

www.bundeswehr-und-mehr.de

Or you could get the "civvie version" here - with optional external pockets (no option for the internals, as it seems, though) through the same shop here:

Original Bundeswehr Fliegerjacke | BW-Shop

Original Bundeswehr Fliegerjacke online bestellen - versicherter Versand weltweit mit DHL✔ 30 Tage Rückgaberecht✔ Kundenservice unter 03877 561171

www.bundeswehr-und-mehr.de

The grey version is the Luftwaffe/ Heeresflieger/ old Marineflieger jacket. The black one is the Bundespolizei (federal police) jacket.
There's no Marineflieger petrol coloured option here, which makes me glad I pulled the trigger on it back in the day.

Is the jacket any good, you may wonder. Well, it's not exactly fashionable today in light grey, and it's not quite the timeless A2 or M422 that can easily be worn with a shirt and tie and not make you look out of place. It's a great piece of equipment, though and it's absolutely bulletproof. And it certainly looks endlessly better than that abomination of the plastic jacket that's issued nowadays.

Now, I wonder if there's a similar way of procuring the french PN leather jacket (preferrably the 70s version with the oval arm-pocket) by an original vendor? Seems like there's only repros on the market.
____
*they'd send them loosely with the jacket, so you could stitch them on if you wanted