Good Wear RW vs Original

[kiltie]

Bouncing around the internet a while back, I came across some pictures of a Rough Wear 27752. They may be pictures of a jacket belonging to someone on this forum, and if anyone recognizes them, please chime in. At any rate, I remembered when I posted the first pics of my Good Wear Rough Wear 27752, Roughwear ( Andrew ) commented on the color being somewhat more rare in that particular contract. So, I was pretty amped when I came across these: a much lighter colored RW of the same contract. Original on top, GW underneath. As luck would have it, it seems the owner of this original and I have the same floor. The final two pictures will illustrate something else; a thing that had been a minor source of irritation until I saw the relative picture. More on that in a minute... The pictures of the Good Wear came out a little on the "warm" side: it's not quite as red as it appears.

And a final original comparison. It rubbed me the wrong way, ever so slightly, the disposition the knits on this Good Wear had assumed until I saw this picture.

It's amazing - to my eye - how similar it is to this:

...seeing where the knit is attached through the sleeve. The way the knit wants to roll back over the leather... interesting quirks.

 

[Andreart]

Look at the pocket placement on the original. the center line is the wind flap edge, no the zip. interesting.

 

[kiltie]

Moreover, my jacket is a 48 and the original is a 36. The difference in the relative size of the pockets is considerable.

 

[Roughwear]

Interesting comparison. The colour of original RWs from the large 27752 contract varied from caramel through to dark seal. The comment about the pockets is interesting. The pockets on my 3 original RWs are all larger than those on the GW RWs that I have seen. I'm not quite sure why this is the case especially as John based his repros on originals.

 

[767fo]

Did you soak your GW in water?

 

[kiltie]

Did you soak your GW in water?

Not intentionally. See my last post here for how that went down -
http://www.vintageleatherjackets.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=13384&start=20

Interesting comparison. The colour of original RWs from the large 27752 contract varied from caramel through to dark seal. The comment about the pockets is interesting. The pockets on my 3 original RWs are all larger than those on the GW RWs that I have seen. I'm not quite sure why this is the case especially as John based his repros on originals.

In the same thread I link to above, you can see a couple of more 'straight on' pictures of this jacket. Taking the size into consideration as well as these shots on the floor are from, let's say, maybe a seventy degree angle... further contributing the the shorter appearance. They ( the pockets ) are similar to Bill Kelso's pockets in a 46 and plenty useful. I'd say primarily it's a bad angle, accentuated by the relatively large body of the jacket ( considering the pockets on the 36 original rival "mall big" pockets...).

 

[Dr H]

Look at the pocket placement on the original. the center line is the wind flap edge, no the zip. interesting.

Odd placement. Not sure how representative - the example in the Eastman book has the 'normal' placement.
Wonder if this one was a Friday afternoon jacket

 

[tater]

Were pockets all the same size? Ie: one fabricator cuts a zillion pockets, then they get slapped on jackets regardless of jacket size?

 

[Roughwear]

In theory the pocket stayed the same size irrespective of the size of the jacket. However there were variations in the size of pockets within contracts and between contracts by the same maker, but they had nothing to do with the size of the jackets.

 

[Robman]

Just a thought with respect to color. Many times I see where people refer to an a2 as russet when in fact it's original color was probably much darker. Happens a lot with aeros and rw 27752s......not in this case but often.

 

[bfrench]

I

Hi, Guys,

I just noticed the original pic seems to have been reversed - notice the pilot's wings on the right side and the name badge on the A-2 is on the wrong side in the original.

 

[Roughwear]

Just a thought with respect to color. Many times I see where people refer to an a2 as russet when in fact it's original color was probably much darker. Happens a lot with aeros and rw 27752s......not in this case but often.

You can always check the original colour by looking inside the pockets. More contracts were russet than a darker seal colour. Many Wartime Aeros were spray finished in a dark seal over a russet base coat and as the top coat wore off the russet undertones appear.

 

[tater]

In theory the pocket stayed the same size irrespective of the size of the jacket. However there were variations in the size of pockets within contracts and between contracts by the same maker, but they had nothing to do with the size of the jackets.

Yeah, that's what I was getting at. So the pockets would look rather larger on a 36 than on a 46 jacket (relative size).

 

[regius]

the fact that the original 27752 has off centered pockets, something like what Dubow would do, I am beginning to lose faith in this "accurate" reproduction concept, since if the original RW doesn't even comply with what we say they do, it seems anything goes, in other words, maybe the lost worlds Dubow is actually an accurate repro of a certain peculiar Dubow in the past?

 

[kiltie]

the fact that the original 27752 has off centered pockets, something like what Dubow would do, I am beginning to lose faith in this "accurate" reproduction concept, since if the original RW doesn't even comply with what we say they do, it seems anything goes, in other words, maybe the lost worlds Dubow is actually an accurate repro of a certain peculiar Dubow in the past?

On that note, I guess it would be kinda neat if you got a hyper-authentic reproduction of a particular original on hand ( with the maker ), then received a photograph of that original with your repro. Naturally, with folks like Bill Kelso and Good Wear, that'd mean getting a pic of a ratty old jacket before it was torn down for patterns, but still... A clone, if you will, of that jacket.
It's clear though, the intent of capturing the common nuances of the individual contracts, and that in itself is both satisfying and fascinating. You can't do a Cable and call it an Aero ( unless you're Aero... then I suppose you can do anything and call it an Aero ).

 

[TOMG1401]

I would never have identified the Goodwear as a repro of that particular original in a million years, also your knits seem to be in bad shape

 

[kiltie]

Are you following the thread, or just looking at the pictures?

 

[Andreart]

the fact that the original 27752 has off centered pockets, something like what Dubow would do, I am beginning to lose faith in this "accurate" reproduction concept, since if the original RW doesn't even comply with what we say they do, it seems anything goes, in other words, maybe the lost worlds Dubow is actually an accurate repro of a certain peculiar Dubow in the past?

On that note, I guess it would be kinda neat if you got a hyper-authentic reproduction of a particular original on hand ( with the maker ), then received a photograph of that original with your repro. Naturally, with folks like Bill Kelso and Good Wear, that'd mean getting a pic of a ratty old jacket before it was torn down for patterns, but still... A clone, if you will, of that jacket.
It's clear though, the intent of capturing the common nuances of the individual contracts, and that in itself is both satisfying and fascinating. You can't do a Cable and call it an Aero ( unless you're Aero... then I suppose you can do anything and call it an Aero ).

basically why i dont get my nuts in a bunch over repros, There REPROS, no matter who makes them. :lol:

 

[2jakes]

the fact that the original 27752 has off centered pockets, something like what Dubow would do, I am beginning to lose faith in this "accurate" reproduction concept, since if the original RW doesn't even comply with what we say they do, it seems anything goes, in other words, maybe the lost worlds Dubow is actually an accurate repro of a certain peculiar Dubow in the past?

" I am beginning to lose faith in this "accurate" reproduction concept, since if the…
original RW doesn't even comply with what we say they do, it seems...
anything goes...

You hit it right on the nail !

 

[TOMG1401]

I've read every word, and it seems a bit of a stretch to say your repro MUST be a copy of some orig. RW. Seen quite a few RW 27752's
plenty around, non close to that. That being said your jacket is beautiful