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Decent, moderately priced A2

T

TrainDriver

Member
Out of curiosity, what is someone “missing out” on or lacking with a Cockpit, or Avi, or 5 Star, or US Wings as opposed to Eastman or Aero? If someone is not looking for the absolute closest thing to 1940, what give ELC or Aero the premium price?

Not trying to pick a fight or start any flame wars - I’m a happy middle of the road type fella. I believe that sometimes cheaper is cheap and sometimes more expensive is just more expensive.
 
Greg Gale

Greg Gale

Well-Known Member
About AVI vs 5star, check out some reviews and pictures on the forums. They all fit slightly differently. See which one you like better.

In my subjective opinion AVI jackets have a much better pattern/ fit. Also, I don't quite like the color shades of most of 5star's hides, but that's just me. Quality wise they both are really great for the money.
 
Brettafett

Brettafett

Well-Known Member
TrainDriver said:
Out of curiosity, what is someone “missing out” on or lacking with a Cockpit, or Avi, or 5 Star, or US Wings as opposed to Eastman or Aero? If someone is not looking for the absolute closest thing to 1940, what give ELC or Aero the premium price?

Not trying to pick a fight or start any flame wars - I’m a happy middle of the road type fella. I believe that sometimes cheaper is cheap and sometimes more expensive is just more expensive.
Click to expand...
Others will chime in, but very basically...

Cockpit's jackets are generic, modern interpretations of the basic design. Patterns are not copied off any specific WW2 original contract and are 'opened up' to accommodate the 'modern man'.
All the hardware is modern repro.
US Wings even more so. AKA Bomber jackets ;)
Cockpit's WWII Gov issue is closer to the WWII A-2 design, but not worth the asking price. Rather look to Bill Kelso (or Aero), for a much more authentic jacket.
But beware... These are patterned off originals, so were made for the young 20-something WWII pilot in mind. Go for an 'easy' contract and size up.

Both AVI and 5 Star have copied thier patterns off original WW2 jackets. I cant speak for 5 Star as Ive not owned any, but every jacket AVI Leather offers, is patterned and detailed off originals in their collection.
Authentic detailing and hardware is tricky for any modern day repro maker. Period-correct zippers, authentic WW2-like leather, knit weave, snaps, hooks, lining material etc... All these details are uncommon today, so as-close-too needs to be sourced, within budget.
The people making these jackets, as skilled as they are, do not have the same machinery, understanding or knowledge of specific techniques used back in the 40s.
So, some detailing in reproduction may be missed, comparing to top end makers.

But what you get with AVI and 5 Star are great period, contract-specific reproductions, that are a lot closer to originals than the genetic brands (Cockpit, US Wings, etc), using the correct leather type, horsehide and goatskin (cow available with 5 Star I think), decent hardwearing components, not as authentic as those used on the hight end jackets, but close enough for a reasonable sum.
These jackets are also customisable to a degree (adding an inch here and there and hope for the best).
At least size one up from your chest, maybe two if you want to layer or require more room.

The materials AVI and 5 Star use and the detailing in the construction and patterning, do not come close to what is offered by the high end makers who have sourced or even produced specific materials/ components, sparing no expense (passed on to customer).
The high end makers like GW, Bill Kelso, Eastman... the Japanese brands, actually have some of these components custom- made. This is where a lot of the big costs come from.
Especially the leathers and zippers. And they have really studied the nuances of these designs, in many cases, taking old originals apart to study how they were made.
The Devil's in the details...

Edit. I know we are specifically talking about A-2s, but I have to mention... AVI's M-422A is a spectacular jacket for the price. Super comfortable and easy to wear.
The mouton collars at least as good as any high end repro.
www.vintageleatherjackets.org

AVI LTHR's long-awaited M-422A (NXs. 416) pics and review

I've been wearing this jacket often since I received it, and initial impressions stand up. Its a beaut! Patterned after AVI's original WW2 Gordon & Ferguson M-422A, the jacket looks right and fits comfortably. AVI have done a good job of incorporating most of the G&F detailing into their...
www.vintageleatherjackets.org www.vintageleatherjackets.org

Also have a look at thier ANJ-3 jacket (1943 hybrid of an A-2 and an M-422A). You get the practicality and comfort of the M-422A's bi-swing back and rayon lining, and some A-2 detailing. A very easy to wear, practical and comfy jacket.
www.avileather.com

ANJ-3 Flight Jacket - AVI LEATHER

We have modelled our jacket on an original WW2 Gordon & Ferguson M-422A jacket in our collection. We studied our jacket carefully, copied the pattern and replicated all the important details.
www.avileather.com www.avileather.com

I did a review here
www.vintageleatherjackets.org

AVI LTHR's ANJ-3 Flight Jacket pics & review

AVI's new ANJ-3 This is their 'take' on the 1943 ANJ-3, essentially their M-422 with a leather collar, epaulets, regular left pocket and brown rayon lining. As AVI says, its... "what they would have supplied the Quartermaster if they were producing jackets back in 1943"... Its damn comfortable...
www.vintageleatherjackets.org www.vintageleatherjackets.org
 
Last edited:
T

TrainDriver

Member
Brettafett said:
Others will chime in, but very basically...

Cockpit's jackets are generic, modern interpretations of the basic design. Patterns are not copied off any specific WW2 original contract and are 'opened up' to accommodate the 'modern man'.
All the hardware is modern repro.
US Wings even more so. AKA Bomber jackets ;)
Cockpit's WWII Gov issue is closer to the WWII A-2 design, but not worth the asking price. Rather look to Bill Kelso (or Aero), for a much more authentic jacket.
But beware... These are patterned off originals, so were made for the young 20-something WWII pilot in mind. Go for an 'easy' contract and size up.

Both AVI and 5 Star have copied thier patterns off original WW2 jackets. I cant speak for 5 Star as Ive not owned any, but every jacket AVI Leather offers, is patterned and detailed off originals in their collection.
Authentic detailing and hardware is tricky for any modern day repro maker. Period-correct zippers, authentic WW2-like leather, knit weave, snaps, hooks, lining material etc... All these details are uncommon today, so as-close-too needs to be sourced, within budget.
The people making these jackets, as skilled as they are, do not have the same machinery, understanding or knowledge of specific techniques used back in the 40s.
So, some detailing in reproduction may be missed, comparing to top end makers.

But what you get with AVI and 5 Star are great period, contract-specific reproductions, that are a lot closer to originals than the genetic brands (Cockpit, US Wings, etc), using the correct leather type, horsehide and goatskin (cow available with 5 Star I think), decent hardwearing components, not as authentic as those used on the hight end jackets, but close enough for a reasonable sum.
These jackets are also customisable to a degree (adding an inch here and there and hope for the best).
At least size one up from your chest, maybe two if you want to layer or require more room.

The materials AVI and 5 Star use and the detailing in the construction and patterning, do not come close to what is offered by the high end makers who have sourced or even produced specific materials/ components, sparing no expense (passed on to customer).
The high end makers like GW, Bill Kelso, Eastman... the Japanese brands, actually have some of these components custom- made. This is where a lot of the big costs come from.
Especially the leathers and zippers. And they have really studied the nuances of these designs, in many cases, taking old originals apart to study how they were made.
The Devil's in the details...

Edit. I know we are specifically talking about A-2s, but I have to mention... AVI's M-422A is a spectacular jacket for the price. Super comfortable and easy to wear.
The mouton collars at least as good as any high end repro.
www.vintageleatherjackets.org

AVI LTHR's long-awaited M-422A (NXs. 416) pics and review

I've been wearing this jacket often since I received it, and initial impressions stand up. Its a beaut! Patterned after AVI's original WW2 Gordon & Ferguson M-422A, the jacket looks right and fits comfortably. AVI have done a good job of incorporating most of the G&F detailing into their...
www.vintageleatherjackets.org www.vintageleatherjackets.org

Also have a look at thier ANJ-3 jacket (1943 hybrid of an A-2 and an M-422A). You get the practicality and comfort of the M-422A's bi-swing back and rayon lining, and some A-2 detailing. A very easy to wear, practical and comfy jacket.
www.avileather.com

ANJ-3 Flight Jacket - AVI LEATHER

We have modelled our jacket on an original WW2 Gordon & Ferguson M-422A jacket in our collection. We studied our jacket carefully, copied the pattern and replicated all the important details.
www.avileather.com www.avileather.com

I did a review here
www.vintageleatherjackets.org

AVI LTHR's ANJ-3 Flight Jacket pics & review

AVI's new ANJ-3 This is their 'take' on the 1943 ANJ-3, essentially their M-422 with a leather collar, epaulets, regular left pocket and brown rayon lining. As AVI says, its... "what they would have supplied the Quartermaster if they were producing jackets back in 1943"... Its damn comfortable...
www.vintageleatherjackets.org www.vintageleatherjackets.org
Click to expand...
Thanks a lot for the reply.
Will these more moderately priced makers, Avi and 5 Star, have the same amount of leather as the other guys? Full grain? Not just a paper thin layer to satisfy the minimum amount to say “genuine leather”?
 
Brettafett

Brettafett

Well-Known Member
The skin on my AVI's are fine, certainly not cheap "genuine leather"... But they are not of the same as those by the high end repro makers.
Understandably.

They are not thick or heavy like Cockpit's (I've owned quite a few), neither are they anything like the lifeless mall fashion jackets.
From what I've gathered, same for 5 Star (I think 5 Star may have more options of leather).

The goat compares well to originals, maybe not as dense, but same thickness, lots of grain.
The HH is fine, correct thickness, some grain & character, supple... Drapes well. The hide on my Bronco does feel a touch vinyl-like, compared to my high-end jackets, but it's not a fair comparison.
We're comparing a $360 to a $1500++ or thereabouts, jacket.

There are a few AVI's & 5 Stars reviewed here. Ive done reviews of almost all AVI's jackets now, even comparing the USN jackets with originals.
 
Blackboxr1200S

Blackboxr1200S

Well-Known Member
I'll add some pictures, can only vote for the 2
2 Fivestar A- 2 jackets I own.
FIrst is a Dubow A-2 in goatskin and second a Horsehide Rough Wear.

Both well built, good value for money jackets.

IMG_20230319_110619.jpg


IMG_20230511_144640.jpg

IMG_20230512_170706.jpg


IMG_20230512_170859.jpg

IMG_20230512_171046.jpg
 
J

JonnyCrow

Well-Known Member
TrainDriver said:
For those asking, I’m probably looking for a 48. I have a 46 Cockpit modern A2 and it seems juuust a bit snug, and I don’t see too many folks offering a 47 1/2, so I think a 48 would be alright. I’d rather have a little too much room than feel constricted.

I believe I’d prefer a russet horsehide. The seal “brown” in the Cockpit modern A2 passes for black in my book.

Someone mentioned the “trainee” line with Aero. That was a good call. I’ll have to keep an eye on those.

Since Avi and 5 Star both come pretty equally recommended, which one between the two?

This isn’t going to be an immediate purchase. Probably closer to Christmas, but gotta fight the wife over “how many leather jackets do you need”, “what’s the difference in that one and the one you already have”…ya know, the same stuff we ask about their shoes.
Click to expand...
Haha I get that all the time from the wife, do you need all those jackets, boots, watches, etc
 
CombatWombat

CombatWombat

Well-Known Member
FlakMagnet said:
They supply/issue the RAAF with A-2 jackets. From what I understand, they're based on an original WW2 pattern.

Christies - NO PATCH

www.christies.net.au www.christies.net.au
Click to expand...
The RAAF doesn't issue any leather jackets but Christie's is one of two authorised companies that you can buy them from under dress regulations.
There is also a legend that they have the fabled V505 drawing and this jacket is based on it......I wore one for 12 years as a combat engineer/load master and it stood up pretty well from jungle humidity (far north Australia/Solomon Islands) to cold mountainous desert (Afghanistan and Nepal)
The leather has a monotonous topcoat which would annoy most people in here but definitely not vinyl/plasticky at all
The goatskin is thick but springy/stretchy
The kints are a chocolate brown wool and the lining is tan cotton drill on mine but looks darker shade sateen nyco/poly cotton on the newer ones
 
veli1

veli1

Active Member
mulceber said:
My best advice: look at the used market. You can find some truly great jackets in the price range you're talking about. For $700 you can get a used Eastman without too much difficulty. $800 might get you a used Good Wear. I've definitely seen some for $900. The Classified section over on the Fedora Lounge, as well as Eastman's Classifieds, will be your friend here. EBay too.
Click to expand...
There are several Eastman A2's on Eastman Classifieds in the range 550 -800 GBP. They're stuck on this page for several months now...Why not sell? Any idea?
 
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