Willis and Geiger A2

[CombatWombat]

Quick question.......has Willis and Geiger ever made a A2 out if HH?
Just picked up one of there's in pretty rough condition (liner is buggered and the knits aren't too much better) but the leather on it isn't goatskin nor cowhide.....no pebbled grain on it and it doesn't seem to be a patent "finished" surface like some cheaper motorcycle jackets have?
I'll post pictures when there's better light in the morning

 

[Juanito]

Yes, I have owned several over the years. The best ones are the late 1980's version with the small zipper pull.

 

[Chandler]

I don't think it's possible to tell the difference between steerhide and horsehide with the naked eye.

Or has new science been discovered (serious question to enlighten me -- no snark)?

 

[Chandler]

Here's a link to some info from the old W&G catalog -- A-2 near the bottom.

Willis&Geiger The Legend Collection

Willis&Geigerは、1902年北極探検家ベン・ウィリスによって創設された本格アウトドアブランド。 アメリカ軍からの要請でパイロット達の防寒性の高い飛行服をも手がけるようになり、更にブランドステイタスを上げていった。

willis-and-geiger.com

 

[Juanito]

I don't think it's possible to tell the difference between steerhide and horsehide with the naked eye.

Or has new science been discovered (serious question to enlighten me -- no snark)?

Nope, I don't think so. The four I had and all the ones I have seen had the leather type specified as either horse or goat on the label. Secondarily, I don't think they ever made a steer hide version, at least while it was still W&G under Burt Avedon's guidance for what it's worth.

 

[Chandler]

...at least while it was still W&G under Burt Avedon's guidance for what it's worth.

This is probably true, the link I added is questionable in its timeline. I had a bunch of the W&G catalogs from way back at one time, but I really can't recall what hides they offered.

What I do recall is that it was a foggy time in reproduction FJs when there were very few authentically manufactured jackets.

 

[CombatWombat]

I don't think it's possible to tell the difference between steerhide and horsehide with the naked eye.

Or has new science been discovered (serious question to enlighten me -- no snark)?

I've owned a lot of motorcycle jackets....most of which are cowhide so I'm "guesstimating" that it's not cowhide because of the stiffness and lack of a grain pattern that looks anything like my other cowhide leather

 

[Juanito]

What I do recall is that it was a foggy time in reproduction FJs when there were very few authentically manufactured jackets.

Man, isn't that the truth. If one reads the advertising as it is presented from that era, one would think Avirex and Willis & Geiger actually were original manufacturers ("We can once again offer...") when they never were, and that they were veg tanned hides (a la Eastman--"Veg tanned, just like 1942!"). I find it wholly ironic that only Cooper is the only one that could realistically make those claims and in practice, never did.

 

[CombatWombat]

And here I thought that Cooper was only good at making balloon shaped jackets lol

 

[CombatWombat]

Here's the culprit..... don't know if the wear on the shoulder or the tag helps in identifying the leather?

 

[Chandler]

I've owned a lot of motorcycle jackets....most of which are cowhide so I'm "guesstimating" that it's not cowhide because of the stiffness and lack of a grain pattern that looks anything like my other cowhide leather

Those qualities could be due to the cut and tanning, not necessarily inherent in the species.

I have a few cowhide and horsehide jackets and they're all very different from each other in grain, heft, and hand.

I should take a picture of my Schott and Flight Apparel Industries jackets side-by-side. Both steerhide, both VERY different in quality.

Throw my GW A-2 into the mix and the game changes even more.

 

[CombatWombat]

Those qualities could be due to the cut and tanning, not necessarily inherent in the species.

I have a few cowhide and horsehide jackets and they're all very different in grain, heft, and hand.

Ahh well I'm just basing it off my experience and since I've never handled horsehide I'll defer to your experience