Random Cool Photo Thread

[ZuZu]

Incredible photo this one as it's a proper combat photo. Kiwis under fire whilst assaulting a building occupied by German Fallschirmjäger at Cassino...

Looks as staged as some of the Soviet stuff from Stalingrad...

Not to say it isn't a great photo though!

 

[Smithy]

Looks as staged as some of the Soviet stuff from Stalingrad...

Not to say it isn't a great photo though!

I know you're trying to be argumentative and be contrary for the sake of it Jeff but you're quite wrong.

That photo, its provenance and the circumstances under which it was taken is well documented.

 

[ZuZu]

Okey dokey. Not trying to be argumentative necessarily. I don't trust...

 

[Micawber]

Not exactly a cool photo but rather thought provoking.

 

[ZuZu]

I know you're trying to be argumentative and be contrary for the sake of it Jeff but you're quite wrong.

That photo, its provenance and the circumstances under which it was taken is well documented.

I may be quite wrong about that photo but there sure are precedents in that particular theater for staging battle scenes. John Huston's famous Battle of San Pietro had all it's battle scenes staged because he was too late for the battle. The dead soldiers were real enough though- so of course he got called antiwar. https://www.thefreelibrary.com/Mani...uston's+The+Battle+of+San+Pietro.-a0457976082


It wouldn't shock me to find out that your photo was staged a few hours after the fact- that doesn't take away from the image- every war photographer wants drama...

If you know better that's great- educate me!

 

[Smithy]

I may be quite wrong about that photo but there sure are precedents in that particular theater for staging battle scenes. John Huston's famous Battle of San Pietro had all it's battle scenes staged because he was too late for the battle. The dead soldiers were real enough though- so of course he got called antiwar. https://www.thefreelibrary.com/Manipulation+and+memory+in+John+Huston's+The+Battle+of+San+Pietro.-a0457976082


It wouldn't shock me to find out that your photo was staged a few hours after the fact- that doesn't take away from the image- every war photographer wants drama...

If you know better that's great- educate me!

Jeff, I've already told you. That photo, its provenance and the circumstances under which it was taken is well documented. All that information is in many things: the official divisional history of the 2NZ Div as well as several books on the 2nd and NZ in the Italian Campaign (it's in at least 4 that I have). It's part of a series of photos taken that day documenting the fighting. You probably aren't aware that Cassino and especially the NZ involvement in the first Battle of Cassino is some of the best combat photography from the Italian campaign.

 

[Smithy]

I'll add this one which was from earlier in the day. That puff of smoke to the right of the Kiwi on the right is a bullet hitting the rock beside him from Fallschirmjäger positions.

If you choose to believe that this was staged and they got some cotton wool out to make it look more realistic like that then that's up to you.

 

[ZuZu]

I'll add this one which was from earlier in the day. That puff of smoke to the right of the Kiwi on the right is a bullet hitting the rock beside him from Fallschirmjäger positions.

If you choose to believe that this was staged and they got some cotton wool out to make it look more realistic like that then that's up to you.

Didn't say I chose- I said I didn't know and that it could have been. (staged). Didn't mean to insult or hurt feelings. The Huston stuff at some point in that battle was staged. It didn't take away from the film.

Just meant to convey my distrust of the Dominant Paradigm.

 

[ZuZu]

This famous photo was probably staged:

 

[Micawber]

 

[Micawber]

Postwar surplus WW2 military vehicles sale. One of many held in various disposal locations in the UK for many years after the conflict.
(Non posed images).

 

[Smithy]

Didn't say I chose- I said I didn't know and that it could have been. (staged). Didn't mean to insult or hurt feelings. The Huston stuff at some point in that battle was staged. It didn't take away from the film.

Not insulted at all Jeff. It's just that the photography from Cassino is some of the closest and most immediate combat photography from the war and it's sad if people are unaware of that.

 

[B-Man2]

View attachment 97133

A railroad box car full of German helmets . At todays prices about $500.00 to $900.00 each think about what that one box car is worth in todays figures. Back when that photo was taken …. You probably couldn’t give them away.

 

[Smithy]

A railroad box car full of German helmets . At todays prices about $500.00 to $900.00 each think about what that one box car is worth in todays figures. Back when that photo was taken …. You probably couldn’t give them away.

It's a great photo. Obviously just after the end of hostilities with US guys trying on some Jerry lids.

They command higher prices than British or US helmets from the war.

I still find it ironic how that "coal scuttle" German design is now the standard helmet design in most modern militaries.

 

[ZuZu]

Not insulted at all Jeff. It's just that the photography from Cassino is some of the closest and most immediate combat photography from the war and it's sad if people are unaware of that.

I did not know that. Even though Italy is my second favorite country in this world (after Greece) I know almost nothing about the Italian campaign- other than it was horrible and depressing. Everything I do know comes from the John Ellis book Brute Force which paints a very unflattering picture od the Allied campaign there. Horrible leadership and a waste of men...

 

[B-Man2]

It's a great photo. Obviously just after the end of hostilities with US guys trying on some Jerry lids.

They command higher prices than British or US helmets from the war.

I still find it ironic how that "coal scuttle" German design is now the standard helmet design in most modern militaries.

Yeah… there’s a whole history to that design and the Germans were really with it, when they choose that design after the massive head injuries sustained by their infantry troops wearing the Pickelhaube helmets early in WWI. That design remained in use with several countries after WWII as well . I have to admit that I’m not really a fan of the new ballistic helmets in use by many of the special ops guys today . It just doesn’t offer much protection to the sides and back of the head and neck from shrapnel let alone a 7.62 round .

 

[ES335]

Yes ! well seen...
Hard to imagine that only 40 years before this photo was taken, aviation had just been invented.

Some of the guys sprited out of Germany just after the war helped get us to the Moon and back.

 

[Smithy]

I did not know that. Even though Italy is my second favorite country in this world (after Greece) I know almost nothing about the Italian campaign- other than it was horrible and depressing. Everything I do know comes from the John Ellis book Brute Force which paints a very unflattering picture od the Allied campaign there. Just a waste of men...

You should read more about it as it's a fascinating campaign where the Italian landscape and mountainous regions necessitated fighting and tactics unlike in the rest of Europe.

Joseph Klein who was a pioneer with the 1st Fallschirmjäger Division (who did many interviews after the war) had fought on the Eastern Front and then in Italy, and said that the Italian campaign was as tough as what he experienced in Russia.

It's the forgotten front in the battle for Europe.

 

[Smithy]

Yeah… there’s a whole history to that design and the Germans were really with it, when they choose that design after the massive head injuries sustained by their infantry troops wearing the Pickelhaube helmets early in WWI. That design remained in use with several countries after WWII as well . I have to admit that I’m not really a fan of the new ballistic helmets in use by many of the special ops guys today . It just doesn’t offer much protection to the sides and back of the head and neck from shrapnel let alone a 7.62 round .
View attachment 97141

Those SF lids are apparently all about lightness and moving quickly in fast, short term ops in urban terrain where visibility and hearing are paramount. A trade off against the heavier grunt helmets wanted in environments with lots of artillery/explosives creating shrapnel and a far more dangerous long term ballistic environment.

 

[ZuZu]

You should read more about it as it's a fascinating campaign where the Italian landscape and mountainous regions necessitated fighting and tactics unlike in the rest of Europe.

Joseph Klein who was a pioneer with the 1st Fallschirmjäger Division (who did many interviews after the war) had fought on the Eastern Front and then in Italy, and said that the Italian campaign was as tough as what he experienced in Russia.

It's the forgotten front in the battle for Europe.

Have you read the Ellis book? He's not big on either the British or American leadership in that campaign. Made the Germans look good.

'Til the inevitable end...