Private purchase jacket with painted patch on Navy pilot.

Discussion in 'Vintage' started by oose, Jan 3, 2019.

  1. Eastwood

    Eastwood Member

    Messages:
    73
    Ken at Aero Leather I saw this kangaroo with a bomb, they are very similar. But the wings are different and differently located. And it seems to me that someone is holding a kangaroo from above. The first thing that seems to me is a flying fish, may be angel, not bird.
     
  2. oose

    oose Active Member

    Messages:
    853
    Location:
    London
    Hi all,
    Its from the SDASM Archive and all its says is "unidentified navy personel 1940s" so not very helpfull. Here is another one from the same collection.

    45633721444_a68029303a_o.jpg

    All the best
    Stu
     
  3. unclegrumpy

    unclegrumpy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,632
    Yes...not much help at all. This guy is wearing Navy Medical Corps insignia...but does not have a flight surgeon's wing. Interestingly, his hat looks like it might have an aviation green cover...so he is likely a doctor, but not a qualified flight surgeon.
     
  4. dinomartino1

    dinomartino1 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    275
    Location:
    Perth Australia
    unclegrumpy and B-Man2 like this.
  5. B-Man2

    B-Man2 Well-Known Member

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    3,516
  6. dinomartino1

    dinomartino1 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    275
    Location:
    Perth Australia
    A lot of the photos which may be at the same location have the word consolidated in the title as does the one of the flight jacket, some are dated 1950, the landing field photos are called consolidated flight line or facilities.
    So possibly Consolidated aircraft San Diego 1950.





    32484732098_7a745bcd0b_o.jpg
    pictionid73380809 - catalogkemp00005 - title--consolidated fascilities - b36 flight line ca. 1950 -
    32484760528_615744c23f_o.jpg
    pictionid73382032 - catalogkemp00061 - title--consolidated unidentified navy personel 1940s
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
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  7. unclegrumpy

    unclegrumpy Well-Known Member

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    1,632
    The 1950 date fits with the photo.

    What also fits is my previous thought that the fellow in the center might be a civilian technical representative. It was common for aircraft company employees....maintenance, engineers, and test pilots...to intermingle with military units...especially when they were introducing new technology or aircraft....and wear military uniforms when they were doing it.

    Consolidated Aircraft Company is a big clue. It does not help much with the patch, but it does start to explain the lack of rank insignia and the civilian jacket. That said, the kangaroo still almost certainly points to an Australian connection. It starts to make me wonder if the Australian's were buying aircraft from Consolidated, and if this guy may have been a part of that effort....training or ?
     
  8. dinomartino1

    dinomartino1 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    275
    Location:
    Perth Australia
    They did buy Lockheed Neptunes from 1951-3 and the RAAF crews flew them back to Australia, but no other US from that time.
    Normally an RAAF pilot would be wearing his own uniform.
    Might also be someone from a navy sqn with planes there for conversion to other uses, maitenece, testing etc.
    Someone who served in the Pacific or Oz in WW2?
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  9. Eastwood

    Eastwood Member

    Messages:
    73
    I understand, everyone wants to distinguish himself and show his rightness.;)
    But there are objective facts.
    1. We do not know who this person is.
    2. We do not know the manufacturer of the jacket.
    3. We do not know squadron of the patch.
    4. We do not know what name is written on the jacket pocket.
    My opinion on each of the issues.
    A person behaves confidently and enjoys authority.
    1. A person is certainly a US Navy officer, perhaps a senior officer (Commodore) of the US Navy, this is not a civilian, and not a foreign officer.
    2. The jacket is civilian (almost military) and made in the USA (Desmond's?), or GB, Australia ... Most likely it was acquired by this officer in the early 1930s, when the US Navy had no regular jackets.
    3.4. The officer served abroad in a friendly country during combat operations. The officer had combat experience before the outbreak of WW2. Perhaps the officer helped the friendly country during the WW2. It is possible that this jacket is a gift from a friend. Perhaps this jacket is the talisman and pride of this officer. Moreover, I think that this jacket and patch is the envy of others. That is why he wears it openly and proudly.
    PS Many senior officers did not wear insignia on shirts during the war.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  10. B-Man2

    B-Man2 Well-Known Member

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    3,516
    Hi
    The only thing I would bring to your attention is that if he were a Commander the brim of his hat would have gold braid. The link you posted makes that very clear . This guys hat has no braid which once again according to your link makes him somewhere between an Ensign and a Lieutenant Commander. Just pointing this out as your post was attempting to eliminate inaccuracies and narrow down possibilities.
     
  11. Eastwood

    Eastwood Member

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    73
    B-Man2 US Navy Officer dress whites.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  12. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

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    1,603
    Sorry Eastwood, if the jacket proves to be American or British made then I've learnt NOTHING about vintage tailoring techniques in the last 50+Years

    I'm not necessarily saying it's Australian but it's not European nor is it American or Soviet
     
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  13. Eastwood

    Eastwood Member

    Messages:
    73
    Ken at Aero Leather I saw photo of the 1930s US Air Force officers in Desmond's jackets. Jackets are certainly not similar in design. But similar in accessories, leather and common progressive idea of flying/sport jackets.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  14. B-Man2

    B-Man2 Well-Known Member

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    3,516
    With all respect intended you are confused.
    First you post “look at the wings on his hat,”then delete that post and state that he’s wearing dress whites. The guy has a naval khaki uniform on.
    We are talking about the very first photograph in the thread correct??
     
  15. Eastwood

    Eastwood Member

    Messages:
    73
    Please do not need to catch me on my thoughts that I am writing. The focus is not on me, but on the officer in the photo. Many senior officers did not wear insignia (I'm about the visor) on hat during the war. Good luck.
    PS Take an example from Ken, he always writes on the case and is looking for the truth without catching anyone.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  16. B-Man2

    B-Man2 Well-Known Member

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    3,516
    It’s all yours Eastwood . I’m out. I don’t have time for foolishness.
     
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  17. Eastwood

    Eastwood Member

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    73
    Good riddance!
     
  18. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

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  19. Eastwood

    Eastwood Member

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    73
    I do not claim it. This is just my thought for reflection. But agree that in this civil jacket a lot of photos of US Air Force pilots during the 1930s. And especially who served overseas US..BoB, China, Spain..I think Desmond's had a lot of jacket models ... so why not
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
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  20. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

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    1,603
    If I was making a book on the country of original it would go something like this

    1-10 Australia
    12-1 New Zealand
    33-1 Canada
    66-1 Holland
    80-1 France
    150-1 Elsewhere in Europe
    500-1 USA
     
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