Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 emblem

[EMBLEMHUNTER]

Hello members, hoping someone of the forum can help me out, I have a customer that wants a leather patch made of the 1934 mission to Alaska Flown by Hap Arnold and others in a 10 ship B-10 flight, I have so far only found poor quality black and white images that aren't useful and hope you guys can help me out , I know a lot of you have some great archives etc , so I hope to hear from you , much thanks all !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Johnny Signor/Emblemhunter

They had the emblem either painted directly onto their jackets or in patch form , not sure which but the emblem has a bird wing spread and on the wings looks like two arrows/bombs , below the bird a Indian "totem pole" , all on a round background ................

 

[oose]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Hi,
best I've got, I'm sure I've got better on a hard drive somewhere...



image url


post img

All the best
stu

 

[EMBLEMHUNTER]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Thanks Oose, that's the one I'm looking for , but the main problem is it not being in color , the details on your photos are much better than I've found so far , but again at least these show some details and are clear , much thanks !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now to track down what colors this one was...............................
Johnny

 

[oose]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Hi, had a look and dug up a few more photo, had a play I recon there are about 4-5 colours, good luck finding a colour version, someone out there may have an original, but I recon its going to be a hard one to crack!

All the best
Stu

 

[EMBLEMHUNTER]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Much thanks for the additional images , they're more I've not seen !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! yeah , I know it's going to be difficult to find the colors on this one, it being so far back and an somewhat "obscure" part of the early AAF history , but I figure posting the question online and on sites will at least get people looking, thanks again for the help !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Johnny

 

[oose]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Video link, shows the patch at the end, different tone range due to film used. Looks cold! notice early B-3's!


http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675 ... under-wing




All the best
Stu

 

[6148th T.C.Squadron]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Stu is the man

 

[dujardin]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

splendid Oose, splendid

thanksssssssssssss

 

[oose]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

some detail for you...I like research!





All the best
Stu

 

[a2jacketpatches]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

The patches look like the field is a darker color than yellow, probably red or blue.

 

[oose]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

The patches look like the field is a darker color than yellow, probably red or blue.

I think its the same the photography film off the time can represent colours in B&W in funny ways if you look at the photograph of the pilots in front of the plane the map of Alaska is dark and not visible, yet on the moving film the patch background and the map of Alaska are much lighter. We will only know when you manage to dig up an original!
see how dark the film makes the map of Alaska in this shot.


look at the tonal ranges, the plane we know was blue and the wings yellow, I suspect the eagle was black, looking at Alaskan Native American Indian artwork there is a lot of red black and white.


All the best
Stu

 

[a2jacketpatches]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

In a few of the photos with the patch on a jacket in shade (guys front row kneeling), there's quite a contrast between the white and disk color. I can see how light hitting the patch could give the illusion of a light color because there certainly is an equal amount of sheen to both the jacket and patch. But in a shade situation, there seems to be too much difference to be white and yellow. Not out of the question for the patch and plane emblem to be different considering the patch field isn't representing a map of Alaska.

 

[oose]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Patch and plane embalm when taken from movie film, note background of patch and Alaska are lighter.




With Photographic film used Alaska and patch background appear darker.



All the best
Stu

 

[EMBLEMHUNTER]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Yeah the patches are probably blue with a yellow border, the totem symbols are probably black and red mostly as I did some totem pole searches online and they appear to be of Tlingit or Tsimshian origin and some of theirs were mostly those colors , but again I'm guessing at the patches true colors .

Some more Great posting of Images I didn't have or haven't seen, Much thanks Stu !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Johnny

Any guess as to what the "symbol " below the eagle is , Person , Owl ??????????? the above one is an eagle/bird and the bird with wings is most likely the raven as the Indians used it a lot on their emblems

 

[EMBLEMHUNTER]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

I have a better image of Hap wearing the emblem I'm seeking , if someone will please "PM" me their e mail I'll send the jpg to you and you can post it here , I don't know how to post on the forum .........................

 

[dujardin]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

hellooooooooooooo



i receive a mail from Johnny



----------------------------------------------------



here's an image of the patch I'm seeking the colors for that I posted a note about on the VLJ forum, if you could post it on that area for me I'd appreciate the help







-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



yesterday, i had a little time and try to found a color version of the patch; alas ... no result.



but i discover in a pdf file about arctic armies and saw this emblem, maybe it could help ... to figure possible colors in that regio at that era...











and also this nice photo







see youuuuuuuuuuuuuu

 

[oose]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Hi Guys, Thanks Marcel, 5mins in Photoshop, its very ruff, don't be to critical!, colour are a guess and I'm sure I'm wrong on most!! still needs some detail especially in the totem, but I've got to take the kids to the park.



All the best
Stu

 

[EMBLEMHUNTER]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Hey all, Much thanks for the postings, Marcel for posting the image I sent you , and stu I'll send you the image shortly !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Johnny

 

[oose]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Hi Thanks for the image, here is a list of all the officers on the flight, you could try and contact any living relatives, see if any have the patch!! It might be the only way!
All the best
Stu

Officers Connected with the 1934 Alaskan Flight

1934 rank final rank

Main Party

Arnold, Henry H. LTC General of the Air Force
Carr, Lawrence J. 1Lt Brigadier General
Corkille, John D. Capt died of natural causes 1943
Dunn, Ray A. Capt Brigadier General
Griffith, John S. 1Lt Colonel
Grow, Malcolm C. Maj Major General
Harman, Leonard F 2Lt Brigadier General
Howard, Charles H. 1Lt killed in flying accident Oct 1936
Knerr, Hugh J. Maj Major General
Larson, Westside T Capt Major General
McClellan, Hezekiah 1Lt killed in flying accident May 1936
McClelland, Harold M. Capt Major General
Royce, Ralph Maj Major General
Snavely, Ralph A. 1Lt Brigadier General

Advance Party

Bobzien, Edwin B. Capt Colonel
Hoyt, Ross G. Capt Brigadier General

Support Party

Goddard, George W. Capt Brigadier General
Ridenour, Caryle H. Capt Brigadier General

Deselected

Chauncey, Charles C. Capt Major General
Eubank, Eugene L. Capt Major General
Fenander, Walter 2Lt unknown
Freeman, Richard S. 2Lt killed in flying accident Feb 1941
Henry, Draper F. 2Lt Colonel
Kelsey, Benjamin S. 2Lt Brigadier General
McCormick, Harlan T 1Lt Colonel
Mills, John S. 1Lt Major General
Smith, Andrew W. Maj Colonel
Twining, Nathan F 1Lt General

 

[EMBLEMHUNTER]

Re: Need clear/detail image/colors Hap Arnold Alaska B-10 em

Wow , Great listing on the crews and much thanks for that !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I found only a few so far , so you did some good research for sure !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Too bad I couldn't figure out who did the original art for the patches , that would help too ,they had to have been done up prior to the mission seeing as they were all wearing them when they arrived at Fairbanks ..............................

Again much thanks to all for the help , I'll dig out my old AFA Association member roster book and see if I can get any leads via the names !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Johnny