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Help with preservation of ELC Irvin

rikbb

Active Member
Hello,
I've had my ELC Irvin now for a year.
It should be about 10 to 15 years old though.

When I received it it had 3 dry spots.
One on the side of each arm, in the corner
of the main elbow crease, and one behind
the zipbox down at the start of the zipper.

So, I contacted Gary at ELC to ask what to do.
I got the ELC leather treatment kit.
(one cleaner product and one cream)

I've used the cream about 5 times over the last year.
And look what happens, it seems to crack and dry all over.
Did I use too much, not enough?

I've now ordered the Pecard's antique restoration cream.
How should I apply it? How often?

thanks
dry01.jpg

dry02.jpg

dry03.jpg
 

rich

New Member
If this is somehow happening without rough use or abrasion, it seems very curious. I think you need to apply Pecards
annually but some people think it has a long term negative effect ....................
Too much may overly soften the skin and cause it to tear. I've never had to apply it to a repro and I have some around 20 years old. I think the kind of wear you show adds good character so long as it hasn't weakened the jacket - but I hope you can sort it out.
 

PADDY_M

Well-Known Member
It's character building. Just adds to it. That wouldn't worry me.

My ELC (See ELC Irvin thread) is 15-years-old. It's got parts where it shows heavier use. Just makes it look used.
 

John Lever

Moderator
Those 'dry spots ' look like areas where the acrylic has worn off. Pecards or any other fat will not replace the acrylic, so if you don't like the colour degradation it will need to be stained to match the surrounding area.
A possible solution would be some kind of timber or leather stain, but as the results are unpredictable I would test a small inconspicuous patch first. Any treatment would require the removal of grease from the skin.

To me, the wear of the surface is what makes the jacket look better and is what Eastman are trying to achieve with the 50 Cal.
Yours is the real thing.
 

Jaydee

New Member
I got the ELC leather treatment kit.
(one cleaner product and one cream)

I've used the cream about 5 times over the last year.
And look what happens, it seems to crack and dry all over.
Did I use too much, not enough?

I've now ordered the Pecard's antique restoration cream.
How should I apply it? How often?

I have no experience with the ELC stuff but I have used Pecard for years. I agree that the surface looks like it has has worn off in these areas. Looks great! :)

Pecard is to be used very sparingly. There are some extreme situations that are exceptions to this, but generally a very light coat does it. IMO You should only apply it if the leather is getting overly dry. Once a year if needed.

If there is a lot of dirt or old conditioner build up, I wash the leather with Lexol PH cleaner. Then wipe it clean with a wet cloth, and immediately wipe dry with another cloth . I let the jacket air dry for awile just to be sure it's totally dry.

Then I apply a light coat of Pecard (Keep it off the fur!) Let the Pecard soak in for awile. The dryer the leather the longer the time. I recommend between 3 to 12 hours. Then wipe it off with clean, dry, rags.

One nice thing about Pecard is that it waterproofs the leather. Water beads up and rolls off after treatment. You don't want to use too much though, or it will come back to the surface and turn white. Also avoid thread, knits and again, the fur.

Good Luck, JD
 

John Lever

Moderator
I have to say that the surface in question is not leather but a plastic coating over the reverse side of leather. The reasons this acrylic coating is used is because the leather is inside out.

The actual leather surface is at the base of the wool hair follicles. Any grease or fat based product will just sit on the coating and oxidise or go white and collect dirt, unless the surface is porous.
 

Jaydee

New Member
John Lever said:
I have to say that the surface in question is not leather but a plastic coating over the reverse side of leather. The reasons this acrylic coating is used is because the leather is inside out.

The actual leather surface is at the base of the wool hair follicles. Any grease or fat based product will just sit on the coating and oxidise or go white and collect dirt, unless the surface is porous.

Yes, I have to admit I was thinking of tanned leather and not considering the acrylic coating. It would make sense that Pecard could not penetrate a thick acrylic, or if it did it might be a bad thing considering it is a petrolium product. Pecard might penetrate the rubbed off coat areas, but would it react with the coating?
 

rikbb

Active Member
Ok, It certainly is the lighter skin color that shows through the cracks.
I start understanding now, that probably the product from ELC that I have already put on the jacket a few times,
probably only made it worse.
Do original 'Irvins' have a similar acrylic coating? The way the original jackets seem to age doesn't look similar (Or, at least on the photos I have seen). I've never touched an original one though.
 

John Lever

Moderator
I am not sure about original Irvin's when compared to the USAAF shearlings, they did have an acrylic coating. The British jackets may have had some kind of casein based paint on them. They seem to craze rather than flake and It certainly looks much thicker than that on the current repro's.
 

rikbb

Active Member
So, ELC Irvins are in fact wolves in sheepskin: USAAF Shearlings with an Irvin cut…
(I must admit, I'm not a fan of the flaking…)
 

rikbb

Active Member
Hello, So I received the Pecards wax today.
shall I, or shall I not apply it to the ELC Irvin…?
 

deeb7

Gone, but not forgotten.
rikbb said:
Hello, So I received the Pecards wax today.
shall I, or shall I not apply it to the ELC Irvin…?

No, don't do it, read the posts by John Lever again ... he knows what he's talking about. ;)
 

rich

New Member
rikbb said:
Hello, So I received the Pecards wax today.
shall I, or shall I not apply it to the ELC Irvin…?

It'll absorb into the areas that are worn, if these really annoy you then you should do it - it's your jacket remember! Assuming the clear coating on the rest of your jacket is strong, it should make a good job of repelling the Pecards.

You could try unzipping the sleeves and applying it to the flap that's out of view there - just so you know the result. Don't over apply, it gets sticky!

Regret what you did or what you didn't do.........never easy to decide. Tell us how you get on.
 

rikbb

Active Member
hmmm, yes, I'll think about it… and tell you.
I have the idea that suddenly the peeling increases very fast.
I guess the ELC cream was not a good idea in the first place.
 

pharmotard

New Member
Hello,
i bought a second-hand pre-war aero Irvin a month ago ,and it presents exactly what you shown on the picture.
As you Rikbb, i looked for a cream to take care of these dry areas.
I found nothing.

What have you done at the end ?

Thanks
 
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