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Flying Tigers AVG patch ID

Silver Surfer

Well-Known Member
many years ago, while wearing an avg tiger patched original a-2, i was stopped on a street in china town, nyc, by an already old man, who claimed to have made tiger patches for avg guys during wwll. i forget the provence he said he was in, but at the time, my research confirmed that he was near a base in china. he said that there was no real set pattern for the tigers and he made what the gis wanted. he also said that the tigers facing left [out board] were to chase away demons, ie: japanese, and the ones facing inbound were to give strength and heart to the wearer. dunno if that applied only to chest tiger patches or all tiger patches, and scarfs, etc. he told me his name, but i did not have the smarts to write it down, and i had a difficult time understanding his english. he liked my out bound facing tiger, and said that i had nothing to worry about, as it would keep away bad spirits. no, the one on my jac was not one of his. besides the ones made by chinese artists, there were those made by us service men, and many were made in india. perhaps some were made in burma as well. all in all, there are many tiger variants, made of mant different materials.
 

a2jacketpatches

Active Member
Love the story Vic, mind if I use it in a sales pitch? Been wanting to update my tigers and offer them pointing both ways after several orders that way.
 

Silver Surfer

Well-Known Member
of course, sean. go fer it. btw: the old buzzard still had a twinkle in his eyes as he chain smoked luckys. i made his day, as he did mine. man, only in ny.
 

TankBuster

Active Member
The A-2 you show was most certainly patched after his service with the AVG. It's a well known jacket by collectors and has traded hands a few times over the last few years.
As for AVG period "flying tiger" patched flight jackets, there was not many patched AVG jackets period. The ones I have seen photos of are squadron marked. (Mostly 3rd Squadron). I'm not saying that there was "Never" a tiger insignia on a AVG pilots jacket, but it would have been extremely rare.

Now if we are talking about the 23rd fighter group, there is a standard "flying tiger style". See photo below..............

Leather mid to late war 23rd Fighter Group Patch

AVGCollection151_zps8cebc164.jpg


Early 23rd Fighter Group Silk Panel/Patch

023_zps92e1456b.jpg




The AVG/23rd fighter group/CATF confusion rages on year after year.


Here is a wartime silk AVG "Flying Tiger" dress uniform patch

007_zps16aa569b.jpg


Last...a photo of all the 3rd Squadron pilots of the AVG with flight patched flight gear. Note that 2 have the 3rd squadron logo painted on their flight jacket but no tigers.

dupouy2_zps908102e4.jpg
 

a2jacketpatches

Active Member
Chances are that 14th AF emblems are in the mix as well. Many versions of that facing left and right and a very high possibility this is part of what the Chinese guy was saying. This has all been hashed out before several times, not much cold hard evidence, but there are photos of creativity out there. Flying Tiger over the China Sun being painted on a jacket, the Art Deco style AVG inked on a flight suit, use of this, use of that. It'll never be nailed down as to what was done and what wasn't for sure. But certainly my favorite subject and opportunity to use creative license.
 

shedonwanna

Active Member
PLATON said:
http://www.warstuff.com/WWII-USAF-FLYING-TIGERS-SQUADRON-PATCH-i346.htm

Anyone knows anything about this style patch?
Were they used on A-2 or M-422 ? or both?
During which period exactly were this kind of patches used?

Is it the same as this?
http://www.flyingtigerantiques.com/mm5/ ... Code=02AVG

Do you think this is original to the jacket?

Also, what's with the tiger looking the other way? Which way is the correct way?

Thanks your assistance in advance.

The patch is described as a "high quality reproduction" and I recall seeing this artists work back in the 1980's. As for which way the tiger faces would depend on which side the patch is worn. I would place this patch on the right (dexter) which faces the tiger toward the center and not away from the body. If the tiger were facing the other direction I would place it on the left side of the jacket. The dexter side is the side of honor and is often where the group patch was placed with the squadron on the right. For shoulder patches the flow or direction should be forward.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
any objections using this on an A-2 jacket?
i346-WWII-USAF-FLYING-TIGERS-SQUADRON-PATCH-Militaria.jpg


I assume to be period correct the jacket contract should have been made during the AVG years? Right?

I am asking because I got an original with stitch holes and would like to patch it to cover the holes.
 

a2jacketpatches

Active Member
If you like it, patch it. Not everything has to be period correct or perfectly legitimate. If that was the case you could only produce a very small percentage of size 48 A2's
 

shedonwanna

Active Member
It is a licensed copyrighted logo of the AVG Flying Tigers Association. Something to consider if you are going to offer it on a line of jackets.
 

a2jacketpatches

Active Member
shedonwanna said:
It is a licensed copyrighted logo of the AVG Flying Tigers Association. Something to consider if you are going to offer it on a line of jackets.

Actually, my long time customer and friend Bob Schriebman was the lawyer that achieved veteran status for the AVG back in the 80's, He's assured me that the logos are public domain. I think Platon is just considering this idea for a single jacket with existing stitch holes to cover. But I've been going worry free for many years knowing that an honorary member and legal council of the AVG has my back in case of any issues. He just contacted me this past week once again to decorate his new M422.
 

JDAM

Member
PLATON said:
any objections using this on an A-2 jacket?
i346-WWII-USAF-FLYING-TIGERS-SQUADRON-PATCH-Militaria.jpg


I assume to be period correct the jacket contract should have been made during the AVG years? Right?

I am asking because I got an original with stitch holes and would like to patch it to cover the holes.

Agree with others... the patch is not an original period WW2 made piece.

And the Bolster jacket is what Tankbuster says it is; post AVG.

Personally, I've never seen any evidence of a patched AVG (and I mean AVG, not CATF, 23rd, 14th) jacket.

But entirely up to you whether you want to put it on a jacket. To be period correct the jacket should be from the 70's or 80s.
 

shedonwanna

Active Member
a2jacketpatches said:
shedonwanna said:
It is a licensed copyrighted logo of the AVG Flying Tigers Association. Something to consider if you are going to offer it on a line of jackets.

Actually, my long time customer and friend Bob Schriebman was the lawyer that achieved veteran status for the AVG back in the 80's, He's assured me that the logos are public domain. I think Platon is just considering this idea for a single jacket with existing stitch holes to cover. But I've been going worry free for many years knowing that an honorary member and legal council of the AVG has my back in case of any issues. He just contacted me this past week once again to decorate his new M422.

About 15 years ago I contacted Chuck Older about the issue and he sent me a contract to sign. I was painting a lot of AVG patches at the time and wanted to cover my bases. I have since tried to find the copyright online with no success but I still send them a percentage of all AVG patches I make. Plus I got a Chuck Older signature. I lived near Tex Hill and he would sign patches for me.

 
A

Anonymous

Guest
wow nice....

don't worry, this is for an original, keeper and personal wearer
 

a2jacketpatches

Active Member
shedonwanna said:
a2jacketpatches said:
shedonwanna said:
It is a licensed copyrighted logo of the AVG Flying Tigers Association. Something to consider if you are going to offer it on a line of jackets.

Actually, my long time customer and friend Bob Schriebman was the lawyer that achieved veteran status for the AVG back in the 80's, He's assured me that the logos are public domain. I think Platon is just considering this idea for a single jacket with existing stitch holes to cover. But I've been going worry free for many years knowing that an honorary member and legal council of the AVG has my back in case of any issues. He just contacted me this past week once again to decorate his new M422.

About 15 years ago I contacted Chuck Older about the issue and he sent me a contract to sign. I was painting a lot of AVG patches at the time and wanted to cover my bases. I have since tried to find the copyright online with no success but I still send them a percentage of all AVG patches I make. Plus I got a Chuck Older signature. I lived near Tex Hill and he would sign patches for me.


Nice deal with the signatures, I'd love for one of my patches to be signed and framed for my office. They'd deserve a little cut if signed for re-sale. These days it almost like we are keeping a history alive that would otherwise dissolve over a short period of time without these guys appearing once in a while. And even then it's rare that anyone under the age of 40 has any real idea who they were. I think you're ok to keep painting them providing you don't make one of those dies to stamp out the image, that would be considered a mass production tool. That's a point that Bob brought up, that I'm cutting, assembling, and stitching my patches by hand one at a time. It was an actual art form developed in the CBI that I have developed tools to aid in making multiples, but essentially each and every piece requires my personal attention and no two are exactly alike in any way shape or form.
 
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