Does it still make sense to order a Jacket from Goodwear?

[Skyhawk]

Yes. His attention to detail and materials are top notch. John is a great guy and very humble. We have chatted about jackets and details, as well as parts, over the years. He is always willing to help. We have had some great calaborating conversations, exchanging ideas and photos. Some may think that we are competitors but that is not really the case. More like colleagues. We are in a fairly small niche, and although there are some cutthroat members within the niche, he is not one of them. I have great respect for him and have drawn inspiration from his reproductions and attention to detail. It makes me aspire to get things right, and dive deep on the research aspect of reproducing these historic jackets.

 

[ausreenactor]

...and autocorrect is your enemy.

It is NEVER 'Ducking'?

 

[ausreenactor]

Yes. His attention to detail and materials are top notch. John is a great guy and very humble. We have chatted about jackets and details, as well as parts, over the years. He is always willing to help. We have had some great calaborating conversations, exchanging ideas and photos. Some may think that we are competitors but that is not really the case. More like colleagues. We are in a fairly small niche, and although there are some cutthroat members within the niche, he is not one of them. I have great respect for him and have drawn inspiration from his reproductions and attention to detail. It makes me aspire to get things right, and dive deep on the research aspect of reproducing these historic jackets.

Establish the size, buy a second hand jacket you really like, accept subtle fit errors.

Ordering a jacket based on seeing someone else's might lead to a mild dissatisfaction when it arrives. The one that inspired your jacket may be better than your bespoke item.....

 

[stanier]

I have a Good Wear A-2 and a B-3 and a place in the queue that should come round about August September this year. The wait isnt 2.5 years, though neither is it a couple of weeks. But part of the fun is changing your mind every week which jacket will you have!

 

[Mr. Mike]

If you want a GW, you may as well get in the queue.
If a good second comes up that fits, I'm sure you can cancel the order and get your deposit back (same thing if you change your mind down the line).
And you'll have lots of time to decide the contract.

Mulceber above makes a really good point about contracts.... If you get a GW then maybe get something not readily available anywhere else.

I am one of those who have owned GWs, BKs, ELCs, Aeros and the like, and get the sense that you also own/ have owned a number of jackets?
Perhaps Ive been unlucky, but I sold them all off for various reasons. Never quite happy with mine... Three were 'new' orders, one was a second off Ebay.
Great jackets to be sure, and given the chance I would not hesitate to order another. That said, there are other options that imho stand side-by-side with GW.

Also, very nb what B-Man says above. Not only your body measurements, but also any flight jackets you already own.
The more info you can provide John, the better your chances of a perfect fit.

Be careful with other guys' measurements... You could put 3 GWs together of the same contract and size tag and they may all three measure differently.
John is happy to tweak jackets to customers wishes (within reason), so unless its a std off the rack build...

Perhaps an idea, if you dont already have an A-2, is to get in the GW queue, then order a Fivestar or AVI LTHR A-2. They you will have an A-2 to gauge fit and measurements for your GW.
You do not want to wait years and spend a lot of cash on a jacket that just doesn't fit right.

Thanks Brettafett for your feedback. Yes I have come quite a way across various manufacturers except GW so far (i.e. the latter one I did not yet even have met in reality). So if you say from your perspective there are other standing side-by-side with GW, which manufacturers do you judge as such?

My observation (mentioned above) over the last years was just that I got the impression that quality is on the decline for some years now and moves constantly rather into the direction of boutique vendors like e.g. Belstaff or Matchless. It may be a kind of sinister market dynamics that hide prices increased so considerably that even well established vendors simply cannot afford the quality they used to maintain over years. One classic - you cannot simply catch up with increasing end prices even more without loosing parts of the market. However, it could also be that the movement into the more boutique like business just happens purposely (the other classic: increase your market share by entering someone else' market). Either way, it would afflict all manufacturers and that is what I sense is going on over the last few years. Moving into this different market can easily turn out to be a dance with the devil though as one of the main justifiers for high-end pricing tends to get sacrificed, which is the authenticity of an excellent reproduction. Because apart from the looks and dedication to details one important key ingredient remains the quality of the chosen materials to match the reproduction of garment which had its origin in heavy duty workwear. Years ago I had no issue getting on my bike wearing an A-2 without seriously doubting their abrasion resilience ...

Don't want to pee in anybody's pool here but I count this forum as the place to openly share our experiences and I wonder whether you have made similar observations so far.

Thanks a lot guys!

M.

 

[Lorenzo_l]

I have tried contacting Mr Chapman on several occasions regarding purchasing a jacket and never ever got a reply.

 

[Brettafett]

I think you are right with a lot of what you say. There are so many factors at play here.

However, when it comes to high end repros of flight jackets (as per this thread), I think the top guys have to maintain a std (which is already very high) and even improve to remain relevant.
Decent goods and materials increase in price and are sometimes unavailable, hence the prices rises over there years (my first ELC A-2 was circa £425 and my first GW was around $800 if I recall)... There's been lots of discussion about pricing also.
Many of these high end flight jacket makers go so far as having their leathers and zippers developed bespoke (to better represent and mimic WW2 leathers), and some use NOS materials adding that little extra authenticity...
So, as far as the high end makers go, I personally don't see any decline in quality, material or level of detailing.

Depends on how you wear your jackets and what your idea of wear & tear is. If you wear them hard, they will wear and develop character faster... If you fall of your bike wearing your A-2, you will likely damage it (this type of leather was not intended for this purpose).
Some finicky bits like tricky zippers can and do run foul of fiddly fingers or impatience... So there's some relativity here. Generally the quality of these jackets is far better than the run-of-the-mall stuff.

 

[RudyN]

I bought my A2 from John back a while ago. I thought it was expensive, but well worth the cost ($880.00) and wait. The only problem is my fault as I have gained some weight and it does feel a bit tight now, but as i said it is my fault not John's.

 

[Flightengineer]

If you are willing to wait ... why not. My friend made a deposit in the summer of 2017, and John made jacket for him only 2 weeks ago, now he is waiting for it to arrive. No doubt he will get a gorgeous jacket.But what is interesting ... he seems to have already "burned out" and he no longer wants this jacket. He is (almost) indifferent to his purchase cause 4 years ... is a long time. A lot can happen, taste can change, and many priorities in life.

 

[Mr. Mike]

If you are willing to wait ... why not. My friend made a deposit in the summer of 2017, and John made jacket for him only 2 weeks ago, now he is waiting for it to arrive. No doubt he will get a gorgeous jacket.But what is interesting ... he seems to have already "burned out" and he no longer wants this jacket. He is (almost) indifferent to his purchase cause 4 years ... is a long time. A lot can happen, taste can change, and many priorities in life.

See - that is a potential threat I also fear (although it might probably be less likely than not meeting my own measures any more after 4 years ).
Which model and size did your friend order? If his indifference increases and model and size fit ...

 

[Persimmon]

If you are in the queue and you decided not to go ahead can you sell on your place in the 1 and a half / two years or so queue to someone else ? Especially if the spot is getting nearer to start making the jacket

 

[Flightengineer]

See - that is a potential threat I also fear (although it might probably be less likely than not meeting my own measures any more after 4 years ).
Which model and size did your friend order? If his indifference increases and model and size fit ...

A2 Monarch in HH, it seems 44 (I don't remember the exact size). In any case, this is his jacket and I think he will decide what to do with it. May be he change his opinion when get it. It's just that he no longer has the joy and enthusiasm of 4 years ago.

 

[ausreenactor]

If you are willing to wait ... why not. My friend made a deposit in the summer of 2017, and John made jacket for him only 2 weeks ago, now he is waiting for it to arrive. No doubt he will get a gorgeous jacket.But what is interesting ... he seems to have already "burned out" and he no longer wants this jacket. He is (almost) indifferent to his purchase cause 4 years ... is a long time. A lot can happen, taste can change, and many priorities in life.

Four years? Stuff that!

 

[Flightengineer]

Update. Today my friend received a jacket made by John. As soon as he opened the box, all his pessimism disappeared. He said that it ie really a masterpiece and he absolutely happy with this jacket and that 4 years of waiting was worth it for sure.

 

[mulceber]

Nice! Any chance you can get some pics to share?

 

[Mr. Mike]

Update. Today my friend received a jacket made by John. As soon as he opened the box, all his pessimism disappeared. He said that it ie really a masterpiece and he absolutely happy with this jacket and that 4 years of waiting was worth it for sure.

That is excellent and very encouraging news! Thanks for getting back with these insights. Of course second mulceber's ask

 

[Flightengineer]

Nice! Any chance you can get some pics to share?

If he wants to do it, I think he will do it himself, as far as I know he had an account here he just doesn't like to write

 

[Talon_71]

Hello. I recently received my order. John has fulfilled all his obligations and more. Due to the delay due to family circumstances, he made discounts and sewed me two wonderful contracts J. A. Dubow and Monarch MFG. Co. These are real masterpieces from a professional and a very good person! I am very happy and the wait was worth it. I have no complaints about the deadline for the order, besides, I already had a jacket from Good Wear, contract Rough Wear Clothing Co.

 

[B-Man2]

Hello. I recently received my order. John has fulfilled all his obligations and more. Due to the delay due to family circumstances, he made discounts and sewed me two wonderful contracts J. A. Dubow and Monarch MFG. Co. These are real masterpieces from a professional and a very good person! I am very happy and the wait was worth it. I have no complaints about the deadline for the order, besides, I already had a jacket from Good Wear, contract Rough Wear Clothing Co.

Hi Talon
I think you’ll get a bunch more replies and people looking at your jackets if you would post larger images and stay away from posting thumbnails .
Congrats on your new Good Wears .

 

[Flightengineer]

I told you, he will publish it himself.

Incredible jackets, considering that you received two and not one - consider that you were waiting for 2 and not 4