Bill Kelso timeline of leather, with a little wear thrown in...

Discussion in 'Repros' started by Skip, Jan 25, 2018.

  1. jeremiah

    jeremiah Well-Known Member

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    553
    Location:
    Mississippi
    Speaking of smells. My ELC monarch has lost that smell. Very faint now. What I have noticed with other jackets though is not wearing them for a while then putting them on the smell returns so I surmise it is my olefactory senses that get used to the smell when I am wearing day in and day out.
     
  2. Skip

    Skip Well-Known Member

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    1,249
    Location:
    Great Southern Land
    That could be a point Jeremiah, the older Kelso hides seem to exude their fragrance as if its never going to run out. I do notice though if you leave your jacket in the car, in the sun, the aroma does return. Maybe it just needs warming up
     
    M3Cavalry likes this.
  3. M3Cavalry

    M3Cavalry Member

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    84
    Horween chromexcel might be the gold standard for smell, although this liberty hide is up there.

    Just emailed BK that a few of us would certainly order jackets in Victory antique russet horsehide if they ever brought it back. Matt, does that smell any differently than the ANJ3 leather you have?
     
    Skip likes this.
  4. M3Cavalry

    M3Cavalry Member

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    84
    Per BK:

    as much as we like it too, unfortunately, there is no Victory horsehide russet left is stock and we cannot restock as it has been discontinued at the tannery.

    Even if we ever bring back the same leather from that tannery, it will not be in the same antique russet finish as that was a hand applied finish and that method is no longer in use at the tannery.
     
  5. Skip

    Skip Well-Known Member

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    1,249
    Location:
    Great Southern Land
    The antique russet of my Werber smells different to the Victory. The antique actually smells like a horse, quite an unusual and pungent aroma was extremely strong when new, now is quite muted but still noticeable . The victory smells like leather and is fairly strong when in an enclosed space. I'll smell it at work when I leave my jacket behind my chair, ambient warmth brings it out. The ELC warhorse smells just like normal leather and is barely discernible unless your wearing it in a warm environment; the Victory on the other hand is stronger, has a more richer deeper note to its aroma and you do notice it, one thing I like about it. Its definitely to unpleasant.

    Shame about the Victory/antique, just have to keep an eye out for secondhand jackets that appear
     
  6. herk115

    herk115 Active Member

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    I believe you. I live near Las Vegas and it's almost triple digits here, yet I'm running around -- inside -- in my brand new secondhand ELC RW 27752.
     
    Skip likes this.
  7. M3Cavalry

    M3Cavalry Member

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    84
    BK ANJ3 measurements—stock size 44 with no modifications. For reference, I am 70” and 180lbs with a 43.5” chest and 34” waist. Jacket fits great.

    Shoulders: 18”
    Back (from bottom of collar): 25.5”
    Sleeve (with knits, measured along top per BK instructions): 25.5”
    Pit to pit (roughly): 21”
    Front along zip: 22.5”

    My Eastman in a 46 is 19.5 in the shoulder and 22.25” pit to pit. ANJ3 much harder to measure pit to pit accurately. The gussets and biswing are a huge advantage. I’ll be hard pressed to buy another A-2 now having this design.
     
  8. Garylafortuna

    Garylafortuna Active Member

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    Big thank you M3Cavalry. I'm saving up.
     
  9. M3Cavalry

    M3Cavalry Member

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    Anybody bought any new Bill Kelso products recently?
     
  10. jeremiah

    jeremiah Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    553
    Location:
    Mississippi
    I bought a victory hide arco off eBay recently.
    91045EB2-5F96-40B8-8584-B6F2449E2EAF.jpeg
     
  11. Pilot

    Pilot Well-Known Member

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    1,245
    End of June 2018 an 27752 RW A-2...never again.... showed with posts why.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2018
  12. Garylafortuna

    Garylafortuna Active Member

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    197
    Hi M3Cavalry, how is your BK AN-J-3 working out for you? Please tell us your feelings about it. I have been thinking about getting one in russet horsehide just like yours, but there
    seems to be a bit of negative BK talk floating around, so I'm somewhat hesitant. Be good to hear your review. Thanks.
     
  13. M3Cavalry

    M3Cavalry Member

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    84
    Pilot maybe I missed it—where did you discuss yours?

    I like mine a lot. If I had the money I’d prefer Victory leather in dark seal, but $2400 for a jacket is nuts. The russet liberty leather is thicker than my Eastman. Jacket hasn’t seen much wear at all due to heat, but I still think it’s high quality, well-made, and fits well. I’d buy it again.
     
  14. M3Cavalry

    M3Cavalry Member

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    84
    Alright, found your sale thread. Now I’m scared to get mine wet!

    I will saw that Liberty smells richer than Warhorse, as previously mentioned. By an olfactory measure of quality the BK is excellent. I have not gotten mine wet, so I cannot speak to Pilots experience.

    Here’s the thing, guys. I believe the ANJ3 is clearly the best flight jacket design. The pilots of World War II were a bit cheated in not getting them. However, only BK really makes them. I contacted Aero about theirs, and using any leather other than goat renders it non-returnable. I’d have gone for theirs if I could have had the option to return.

    Why not band together and make our interest known to ELC and GW in particular? I personally would pay dearly for a Chapman-made ANJ3 in Shinki Russet.

    Thoughts?
     
    Skip likes this.
  15. B-Man2

    B-Man2 Well-Known Member

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    2,031
    I have an Aero ANJ3 in Goatskin, and I’m very pleased with it. You are correct about it being a great design. It’s comfortable and fits me very well. Just my opinion.
    Good Luck with your search.
     
    Skip likes this.
  16. Skip

    Skip Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,249
    Location:
    Great Southern Land
    Hey M3Cav, good to hear that the ANJ is working for you, and totally agree with you its certainly a more practical jacket in every circumstance. I now have 2 :D, one in goat one in Victory and am happy as Larry.

    On the hide front, I know Dave Sheeley would do one in Horsehide and the one he made for me is one of the best made jackets I own.

    here's the link to his sale page, the first images are of the 3a (mouton collar) last ones are the jacket he made for me AN-J-3. The description states most of what you need to know but as he made a jacket for me any questions I'm willing to answer or go directly to Dave himself.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Monarch-US...819391?hash=item5d810927bf:g:RfoAAOSwyCZbg0Gz
     
  17. Skip

    Skip Well-Known Member

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    1,249
    Location:
    Great Southern Land
    I bought a Dubow 27798 from BK recently and it had a collar issue, slightly off centre. Pretty good customer service, as soon as I mentioned it Andy requested photos of the issue and he advised a little later that they would fix the issue no charge, including reimbursement of postage costs.
     
  18. M3Cavalry

    M3Cavalry Member

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    84
    I’d also posit that goat is objectively a better material—supple, tough, etc—but it just doesn’t weather (read: “look as cool”). I’ll take a look at what Sheeley is doing.

    Anybody know if ELC or JC considered making one? Asked JC a while back to no reply.
     
  19. Skip

    Skip Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,249
    Location:
    Great Southern Land
    Dave can use a russet goat hide, as he did with mine, dye it seal like original USN kit. So as time and wear roll on you get the seal fading to russet at the wear areas. its a little more enhanced in the photo, in the flesh its more subtle. I've had some scrapes and a lot of wear in the 6 weeks I've had this jacket.
     

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  20. Pilot

    Pilot Well-Known Member

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    1,245
    Happy to read that, how about the pockets?.
    Mine... ( my ex RW 27752) were incorrectly wider than higher .A total “no go” for this contract.
    The sleeves were baggy and too roomy, the torso pear shaped and the neck liner wrongly stitched ( facts shown here on several photos) ....plus all other issues with the hide ( coat pealing off, bright orange ..all shown on photos.. under the seal coat, hard and stiff as a brick wall after getting slightly humid during a 10 min.rain walk, chemical odor/stench..etc...).
    Photos of your RW 27752 are welcome...hope you have not the same issues.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2018 at 2:45 AM

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