BILL KELSO N-1

[ausreenactor]

???? Sorry I missed that,
never heard of that term before.

Label switch/replication.

Like a Chevrolet badge on a Holden here or a Pontiac badge on a Holden in the USA.

 

[colekwok]

Label switch/replication.

Like a Chevrolet badge on a Holden here or a Pontiac badge on a Holden in the USA.

Oh, I thought he was saying 'batch' engineering.

Like I said, it may be an OEM product sourced from Asia. For the Japanese and Asian market, you rarely have people requiring anything larger than 44, which makes sense. As for why they don't make larger sizes, some makers simply charge more for bigger sizes because of the extra materials used, I guess particularly in leather jackets. Custom jacket makers such as BK should be able to do that easily with their online ordering system, well, if they want to, that is.

By the way, some manufacturers actually mark down their sizing depends on their distributing countries. If you get a size M Uniqlo labelled sweater in Japan, it may only equates to a size S labelled of the same sweater selling in their UK shops.

 

[Kevin.Two]

Oh, I thought he was saying 'batch' engineering.

Like I said, it may be an OEM product sourced from Asia. For the Japanese and Asian market, you rarely have people requiring anything larger than 44, which makes sense. As for why they don't make larger sizes, some makers simply charge more for bigger sizes because of the extra materials used, I guess particularly in leather jackets. Custom jacket makers such as BK should be able to do that easily with their online ordering system, well, if they want to, that is.

By the way, some manufacturers actually mark down their sizing depends on their distributing countries. If you get a size M Uniqlo labelled sweater in Japan, it may only equates to a size S labelled of the same sweater selling in their UK shops.

Yep, especially true for the Japanese repro makers (RMC, FW, etc.). I'm a true 38, but almost all of my jackets are in a size 40.

 

[D97x7]

I really should know better, but I couldn't resist the olive any longer, order placed, excitement raised. I'm guessing I could be waiting for a while, unless the above speculation is correct of course. Find out one day

 

[B-Man2]

Nick
Good Luck with it.
Looking forward to seeing how it turns out .
Do they list a time frame for delivery?

 

[D97x7]

No, I asked but haven't had a reply to that yet.

 

[Brent]

Nick
Good Luck with it.
Looking forward to seeing how it turns out .
Do they list a time frame for delivery?

Yep, I'll be watching this one closely.


Regards,

 

[zoomer]

Like I said, it may be an OEM product sourced from Asia. For the Japanese and Asian market, you rarely have people requiring anything larger than 44, which makes sense. As for why they don't make larger sizes, some makers simply charge more for bigger sizes because of the extra materials used, I guess particularly in leather jackets. Custom jacket makers such as BK should be able to do that easily with their online ordering system, well, if they want to, that is.

China, especially, supplies the world. If they don't make something in a Western size range, it's because they really do not f%@!!ing want to. It could be because the cost/benefit ratio flips with bigger sizes, or because the potential Western market will never be big enough.

 

[MaydayWei]

Hey guys,

Just got an email from BK on the turnaround for their new N-1s.
The email states: "The jacket will ship about one week after your order is received and transit time is about 3-4 weeks as it ships from mainland China."
That sounds pretty quick to me, but I'm not sure how accurate this time quote is; especially considering the massive delays experienced by other members in our forum on the "Bill Kelso, What's happening?" thread.
But I'd love to know what you all think.
It may well be that BK can make and ship out N1s quickly because they currently have the materials they require to make N1s on hand, but do not the materials required for the other jackets they're having huge delays on. Just a theory, though.

 

[D97x7]

Yes, I got basically the same email, minus the mention of China.

 

[dinomartino1]

Looks identical to an N-1 which I have seen before on Taobao made by a shop called Gizemo which sells in China for GBP 179.
BK site appears to use some of Gizemo's photos.
Same Waldes zip.
50 % wool
50% alpaca

All the photos are from Gizemo.
Sizing seems to be identical.
Gizmo size chart.

BK size chart

N-1 SIZE	Shoulder width	Chest	Back length​	Sleeve length​
36	45 cm	110 cm	68 cm	61 cm
38	47 cm	114 cm	69 cm	62 cm
40	49 cm	118 cm	70 cm	63 cm
42	51 cm	124 cm	72 cm	64 cm
44	53 cm	128 cm	74 cm	65 cm

 

[D97x7]

Hmmm.

 

[dinomartino1]

Gizemo sell the olive %100 alpaca version for GBP 205

 

[D97x7]

Can't say I'm impressed. Don't have a problem with it being made in China, but also being for sale there is a different matter.

 

[dinomartino1]

I am not %100 certain, I may be wrong, but BK appears to be reselling gizemo's jacket or having them made by them, I have not seen the exact same N1 on Taobao sold by anyone else except Gizemo and Taobao is awash with N1's.
Eastman Aero ,BK, buzz rickson etc. are sold by stores on Taobao at greater prices than we pay which makes me doubt this is a BK jacket.
Made in China does not bother me, I don't hear many complaints about buzz rickson's and the majority of their stuff is made in China.
People only seem to have a problem when a Chinese company sells Chinese made.

 

[dinomartino1]

From Gizemo with a poor translation

1ST
NAF, late 1930s, and April 1939.
2ST
DECK HOOK, April 1943.
3ST
N-1 (first generation N-1, Dark Blue , Pure camel hair Neri ) delivered in September 1943
The original contract number is NXSS 22342, manufactured by Popular Mfg Co, New York, NY
N-1( 2nd generation N-1, Dark / light olive green , cardigan , pure camel hair Neri ) delivered April 1944
The contract number at the beginning of NXSX starts at NXSX 38049, manufactured by Drybak Corp, Binghamton, NY
N-1 (3rd generation N-1, Dark / Light Olive Green , Card color ,
Pure llama wool Neri / llama wool mixed spinning Neri) approximate time November 1944 delivery
Contract numbers from NXSX to N-140 ,etc., N140 at the beginning of the same number is used at the end of the 40-year generation and at the beginning of the 50-year generation

 

[MaydayWei]

@dinomartino1
Christ, thanks for that info! If you had not done the due diligence, I would have totally missed that.
I knew the turnaround times sounded incredibly suspicious; and you've gone right ahead and proven why.
Thank you very much for that input, really sheds a whole lot of light and perspective on the 'BK" N-1.
What you've suggested may not be the actual case, but it's very good you brought that to our attention. Thanks mate!

 

[ausreenactor]

I am not %100 certain, I may be wrong, but BK appears to be reselling gizemo's jacket or having them made by them, I have not seen the exact same N1 on Taobao sold by anyone else except Gizemo and Taobao is awash with N1's.
Eastman Aero ,BK, buzz rickson etc. are sold by stores on Taobao at greater prices than we pay which makes me doubt this is a BK jacket.
Made in China does not bother me, I don't hear many complaints about buzz rickson's and the majority of their stuff made is in China.
People only seem to have a problem when a Chinese company sells Chinese made.

Ask a veiled question on the BK Facebook page?

 

[dinomartino1]

@dinomartino1
Christ, thanks for that info! If you had not done the due diligence, I would have totally missed that.
I knew the turnaround times sounded incredibly suspicious; and you've gone right ahead and proven why.
Thank you very much for that input, really sheds a whole lot of light and perspective on the 'BK" N-1.
What you've suggested may not be the actual case, but it's very good you brought that to our attention. Thanks mate!

It still looks like a very good jacket, BK should be more open about it being sourced in China if that is the case, I have no issue with that but many will, a sad reflection of our own irrational prejudices {there is one member here of Chinese nationalist heritage in his case I can understand].
Even the mention of China will send many into a fit of apoplexy so I can understand why there is no mention of that on the BK site but many BK customers will be under the impression that they are getting a BK made jacket which may not be the case.
BK only sates that their LEATHER jackets are made in Greece so by that statement they have not erred, some may consider it a sin of omission though.
The same asian model shown in Gizemos photos appears in most of their other product photos, they are not using somebodies else pictures, they are their own brand and they are the same photos BK uses with the obvious omission of an Asian wearing the jacket.

Like I have said all the facts are not known, I have provided what info I know to help others make an informed decision about whether they want to buy or not.

 

[D97x7]

Well I'm not going to be cancelling even if I could source it cheaper elsewhere, that's life really, happens all the time. I was told I could have bought my Bronson B-10 a lot cheaper on Taobao as well.