1931 GOLDSMITH A-2 Limited Edition of 25

Discussion in 'Repros' started by Ken at Aero Leather, Aug 23, 2018.

  1. jeremiah

    jeremiah Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    574
    Location:
    Mississippi
    man, that wrist knit looks a lot longer than 3".
     
  2. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

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    1,137
    We've drawn up an "ideal body length chart" based on an estimation of Hap Arnold's height, would appear to be no less than 6'1" based on Mary Pickford's height which is well documented. This will ensure all 25 look "right" on the person who ordered it.
    The first sample looks wrong on someone Hap's height
    We are being quite firm about sticking with this as a long body is essential for pocket placement and size. We've already had some (friendly) email exchanges with a couple of customers concerned about the longer body length :>)
    The body length of our jackets will be made in relation to the customer's height, if the customer is on the short side the pockets will be adjusted to suit.
    Similarily the individual jacket sleeve length has to suit both the jacket and customer but the knitted cuffs will be longer than most other contracs.
    We won't be making our height chart available as there are other makers planning a Goldsmith, over the last few decades we've done enough to help the leather jacket trade :>)
     
  3. Officer Dibley

    Officer Dibley Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    317
    Location:
    East Anglia, UK
    "Never before, in the field of repro jackets, has so much been written by so many about so little" :D

    Though i am sure when they are finally made, that each will live up to the hype and frenzy ;)

    I look forward to a veritable plethora of photos of buyers asking if it fits right !

    And each jacket will be a "keeper" - for at least 6 months. Once we know who on here has bought one we should run a book on who will sell on first :cool:
     
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  4. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

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    1,137
    .................and some!!!!!!!

    I sometimes wonder what on earth made me say "Aero are up for making a repro" in the first place, I should be working on next years knitwear range not putting so much energy into what is basically a 25 piece order. :>)

    It's a service industry but someone's got to do it..............wait I forgot there are two more at least on the case :>)
     
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  5. Skyhawk

    Skyhawk Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    718
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Yes and with us laying all the groundwork, it will be a lot easier to make. I wonder what they will "copy" and what features may be different, their own take.

    What would have been really interesting is if we just had the photos, and there was no thread about any of the details. Then to see what was the results in the end. The similarities and differences.

    However, I do like this project and the way everyone chipped in with info and opinions. This has never happened before and it was great to see the community involvement to get this jacket made to every last identifiable detail. This is obviously an important project to our "community" and it is great to see everyone concerned and getting involved to get it right.
     
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  6. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

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    1,137
    Please define "Us" and "They"
     
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  7. Skyhawk

    Skyhawk Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    718
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Us being you and me Ken, with the help of the community. Remember the big thread?

    "They" would be the other makers that may be making a version in the future.

    I am excited to see your finished reproduction, and excited to be building ours. I am Interested to see what else comes out in the future, if any, by other makers.
     
    Ken at Aero Leather likes this.
  8. zoomer

    zoomer Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,100
    Location:
    Gerbracht Aeronautic Corp.
    Is “perimeter” the distance around the inside of the collar, at the top edge when lying down? (This is usually called the neckline.)
     
  9. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,137
    I'd call it Collar Size, as per shirts
     
  10. Bombing IP

    Bombing IP Active Member

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    445
    breeta2.JPG
    Re the collar size here is a picture of a members Eastman jacket the picture angle makes the collars look enormous . When we know different ,maybe the Goldsmith angle was the same leading us to the wrong conclusion .With so little information picture wise .I would make the collars the same as a Type A2 , period style of the day would not change that much .

    QUOTE="Brettafett, post: 212227, member: 6283"]
     
  11. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,137
    Sir............Thank you bringing common sense into the collar issue and for putting what is known in Scotland as "The bleeding obvious" into seven simple words .
    It's also due to the way the jacket is half zipped up, not that your explaination needs any further tweaking.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2018
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  12. Brettafett

    Brettafett Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    819
    Location:
    LONDON
    Oooh, I find myself in strange places ;)
    Actually, my mobile phone with which I took that quick pic, does tend to have an inbuilt wider angle, esp on close-up shots... so that may have a slight effect of how the collar appears.
    Collar size must be tricky to nail down... I may be wrong, but in many cases, collars tended to remain the same size, regardless of size of jacket. So the collar size of a given pattern, say a size 38, may appear larger, compared to a size 48 for example.
    Based on vintage photographs, where one has no real way of knowing the size of the jacket pictured, or whether the jacket in the picture is of a smaller or larger size, makes it all 'best guess' work. That said, the 'powers that be' who are making these jackets, have been at it long enough and handled enough originals, to surely make that 'best guess'...
     
  13. Skyhawk

    Skyhawk Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    718
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Only trouble with the angle and small size theories is that the collar appears bigger in every photo, not just in one photo. Also how can you say it is not bigger when there are jackets right next to it zipped up in a similar way, and still it appears bigger?
    A1_SAT_Group-cut.jpg



    Goldsmith-Collar-1.jpg

    Goldsmith-2.jpg

    Screen Shot 2018-06-30 at 1_50_19 AM.png

     

    Attached Files:

    Geeboo likes this.
  14. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,137
    And in every photo the jacket neck is wide open and, as you've probably discovered, the collarstand isn't just deeper, it's also longer making the neck opening larger than later jackets, hence the accentuated "Saturday Night Fever" neckline.
     
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  15. Persimmon

    Persimmon Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,447
    Location:
    Nottingham England
    I am sure it will look great when produced whatever size.
    Just make sure it’s not that RW clown collar look
     
    Ken at Aero Leather likes this.
  16. 2BM2K

    2BM2K Active Member

    Messages:
    334
    Location:
    Sussex
    There is another photograph that has been puzzling me for sometime and I have not been able to find anything more about it.

    The photo is from an SDASM collection belonging to L C Hurd stating that he was in the air corp in the late 1920's to 1930's.
    https://www.flickr.com/photos/sdasmarchives/8068646872/in/album-72157631732202683/

    Everything about the jacket looks like an A2 but there is a big problem in that the aircraft is an SE5A (probably not an SE5E)
    which is too early for an A2 jacket.

    If the photo can be dated to 1933 then that would be perfect for a Goldsmith jacket.

    The only extreneous link I can make is that Hell's Angels (1930) had SE5A's and starred Ben Lyons. Ben Lyons was a keen aviator
    and reserve pilot officer who meet Carl Spatz in Ocober 1932.

    Questions are;

    1. Was there an early flight jacket that had epaulettes
    2. How old is Spatz in the photo.
    3. Is it an A2 jacket
     
  17. Officer Dibley

    Officer Dibley Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    317
    Location:
    East Anglia, UK
    Well at least you can both make whatever collar you think is right. Though of course with one going for a limited run & the other presumably more, we'll never be able to compare sales numbers to see what consumers think of the collars :D
     
    Ken at Aero Leather likes this.
  18. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,137
    dinna fash yersel, as we say in these parts............... Otter may offer a translation...........we are on the case

    Nice Collar.jpg

    It won't look so big when it's zipped up
     
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  19. Ken at Aero Leather

    Ken at Aero Leather Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,137
    I doubt if a 19" collar on a 14" neck or vica versa is going to work out quite as the pattern cutter intended, I've heard that anomoly quoted before to explain a badly finished neckline on a replica jacket
     
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  20. Silver Surfer

    Silver Surfer Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,480
    collar sizes on all a-2s varied, not only between the different contracts [small collars on perrys, large collars on rws and monarchs], but within a specific contract. some of the original makers made one size fits all collars, as well as pockets, thus on larger a-2s the pockets look small, and on small a-2s the the pockets look big. the same with collars, ie: big jacket, small collar, small jacket big collar. btw, this is not a rule, it is a personal observation. on that note, it appears from the pix that the gs [if they are gs] jackets had larger, and higher collars. interesting to me is that there has been no mention of likely gs zipper jetting, as seen on later 30s a-2s.
     
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