ELC Timeworn Vs Warhorse

picked up a jacket that was sold as a Pearl Harbor Time Worn but the seller then said was Warhorse.
I've no experience of either. However, this Warhorse feels very waxy rather than the hides i remember from ELC 10 years ago.
Is there much of a difference between the two hides in weight, look, feel and finish ?
Thanks in advance for any guidence.

Hi there, yes, thats how it is. The hides have changed dramatically in the past 10 years.
They do tend to be slightly thinner and lighter than a decade ago. The finish has also changed over the years, depending on which jackets you are comparing.
Warhorse is the name ELC gives to their premium horsehide, and Timeworn is the (very secret and bespoke) ageing process ELC applies to some jackets to give them that aged, vintage appearance. No harm is done, but it adds £80 to the price!
The current or more recent Pearl Harbour jacket/s are made of seal horsehide with the Timeworn treatment applied. They look nice.
Older versions were made of steerhide I believe, with the Timeworn treatment also applied.
So, if you jacket is horse, then it must be a more recent version. Is it russet or seal? I am not sure if russet versions were made in horse or not. I may be wrong, but I think there were russet horsehide Pearl harbour jackets a little while back... Not sure. This would be a question for ELC.
Would like to see pics of your jacket, incl fit pics.

OK, you just posted pics Looks great. Thats the seal version, so must be a relatively recent jacket. Nice one! Fit pics!!!

Thanks mucker ! I knew as soon as i posted that someone would ask for photos so added them. Didn't anticipate your lightning response time !
Nor did i anticipate the fit pics request and as it's now getting dark out, they may have to wait.
It's not seal as i remember it. Do they call it "Havana" ? It's hardly been worn so stiff as can be. If it's waxed then it might loosen up each time i wear it then stiffen up when cold. That was something i didn't like about the FQHH Aero jackets i once owned. (Personal preference Ken, not a criticism!)

So if it's a recent ish jacket, £400 was a fair price then ? I can't tell if it's horse or cow though.....so assuming War HORSE is the type of hide and not the finish ..?

Yes but once it’s worn in good it won’t stiffen so much when cold. Also, though it feels waxy, it’s not. Get that puppy wet and watch how quickly the water soaks in. No wax treated leather would respond like that. The water would tend to bead on the surface.

Also, check that left hand pocket. If horse it should have a black label in there saying genuine horsehide. They put these in the more recent warhorse hide jackets.

Thanks Jeremiah !
No black label........ feels quite thick. More like cow......

My ELC Pearl, which is pretty old, is seal Timeworn steer. (Not sure how old - I got it used. It has the classic slack, loose-weave knits.)

I would call it a thickish hide but not too heavy. Large areas of carefully-thinned top coloring, with highlights and all edges/seams a light tan, and no hint of russet (they were not going for a depot redye effect). No waxy feel whatsoever. In fact it looks and feels like an old saddlebag.

All in all I like the look of Ofc. Dibley's better, but the greener the grass...

Thanks zoomer !
Photos don't show a black label and it looks a lot like the steer DD i got from Burt.

Wish it were a 46 - I'd make an offer.

Could you post measurements please?

Did ELC sell the house A-2 with Warhorse or Timeworn? I guess I was always under the impression that they went more to specific contracts then began the treatments.
It's funny how all these companies keep adding all these silly names that apparently can never be kept consistent. I say just make a quality jacket and watch the wait time add up!
On topic, a used ELC house A-2 for $525 seams really high to me either way. In my opinion the Warhorse is far more to be desired than being sanded(Timeworn) so at least his description changed for the better. But ethically, I'd return it only if you preferred the Timeworn treatment advertised which is easy to see in pics. IMO, you dodged a bullet. In addition, how do you know its steer unless we just told you? What I'm getting at is if you like ELC jackets and this one fits well it's a keeper. If you feel the steer hide is "off" then so is the Eastman label and other possible house A-2 "liberties". But those are not things the seller misquoted.
Just an opinion,
Dave

I hear you Dave. I 've had maybe 8 ELC over the years but none for 10. Last i had was the russet goat Cable i should never have parted with. I do have an old house seal goat too that has unbelievable grain for a goat.
No-one told me it is cow, i'm just comparing it to the DD i have.
I suppose my 'concern' is more that the hide feels thicker than i remember and the finish different. With this one i don't know what it will look like in 6 months whereas the old ones i knew.
Do i keep it ? Sell it or return it as it is a Warhorse rather than a PH Timeworn ? Or does WH become TW with honest wear ? Decisions, decisions !
Love the sprung Crown zipper !
I beg to disagree on the price. This is stiff and unworn. Like new. £400 instead of £900 seems a good deal to me..... but that is subjective of course.

ELC now do these knits ? My, my, how the world changes !

Well, on balance, i think i'll keep it and wear the crap out of it - when i'm not wearing my GW

I'll post fit pics and better pics and post over time as it wears.

Thanks all . Love this place. Way more helpful people than unhelpful

Here is the knits on my BK dubow. I don’t know much about knits but even with lots of wear these are still tighter than my other two A2 knits and these aren’t as fuzzy like you think wool would be. Any ideas?

Jeremiah, i may be wrong ( and frequently am...) but i though woollen mix garments were the ones that bobbled the easiest and most. Yours look wool to me.
Nice grain on the leather too !

A few more photos. In better light the jacket looks great.

Maybe it’s just the light, but there’s something about those BK knits that doesn’t look totally right, like the ribbng is too pronounced?

What are they like on your BK Aero Jeremiah? Love that jacket.

At £400 you have a very nice ELC A-2 (No matter what the finish) that hopefully will get a lot of wear.
Will you be wearing it at Duxford?